My big concern when importing “delicate/blackwater” fish was always columnaris. For a blackwater fish with a “lazy” immune system, the bacterial loads of life in a glass box can be difficult to adjust to. I’d go pretty nuclear at the first signs of fin deterioration (PP/Salt/RO). By the time the body starts to get fuzzy, the gills are going to be in pretty bad condition.Any hints of what to look for if they need additional meds? I'm really clueless as to what to look for while they are in qt?
Does my close up image (last page) show any indication of such? So far i don't see a hint of columnairs or similar. No fuzz at all. Some of the other fishes i picked up from this guy did come down with ick (had that problem last time i purchased from him); but i don't even see ick on these guys.My big concern when importing “delicate/blackwater” fish was always columnaris. For a blackwater fish with a “lazy” immune system, the bacterial loads of life in a glass box can be difficult to adjust to. I’d go pretty nuclear at the first signs of fin deterioration (PP/Salt/RO). By the time the body starts to get fuzzy, the gills are going to be in pretty bad condition.
I don’t see anything. Just stating the big red flag I’d be watching for.Does my close up image (last page) show any indication of such? So far i don't see a hint of columnairs or similar. No fuzz at all. Some of the other fishes i picked up from this guy did come down with ick (had that problem last time i purchased from him); but i don't even see ick on these guys.
ok - i'll post new images in 2 weeks and if they still look clean maybe release them at that point. Kind of hoping it will be easier to get them to eat other food if they see the tetras going after other foods. Right now they mostly only willing to eat freeze dried black worms; they won't even go after the version with sprintula. Picky little devils.I don’t see anything. Just stating the big red flag I’d be watching for.
I have some thoughts. Take them for what they're worth. I've kept wild Discus off and on since 1968. I used to have a fish store and an attached quarantine/breeding room. The first I was able to get breed was a wild pair of Royal Blues during the first Apollo moon landing mission. I was only 17 at the time and my attention was torn between what to me were two major events. Since then I have had many other successful wild discus spawn.
I have had success with three species, S. axelrodi, S. haraldi and S. aequifasciata. lord knows I've tried but I have never been able to get a spawn from S. discus. My best result was one spawn of S. axelrodi which had been given over an entire 125 gallon tank. That pair raised 147 fry to one inch. Quite the sight.
I'm well aware of the flaws of using beef heart but the fact remains I have had success with it as a staple food in the past. In more recent times I have relied on Tetra Bits, frozen blood worms, live black worms and believe it or not but earthworm sticks have proven to be extremely useful staple food for all discus to me.
Disease treatment.
Always starts in a 40 gal breeder quarantine tank. Large enough to temporarily house six 5 inch discus but small enough to minimize the quantity of medications consumed.
I expect most reputable suppliers now provide some useful treatment such as deworming. However I also know the fish business and prefer to treat my new wild discus. I happen to use a "shotgun" regime consisting of Prazipro, flubendazole and metronidazole(Flagyl.). I began experimenting with Flagyl in 1970.
To each their own but to quote the acid rock music guru, Grace Slick of Jefferson Airplane, "I don't care if there are chemicals in it as long as my lettuce is crisp.)
My problem is telling IF the fish need meds or if the importer/exporter did a sufficient job. Also the seller (importer) had two types - but i do get your point that semi-royal could have been in the same location as the browns he sold me. The other 6 are definitely rougher than the first 4 but again i can't tell IF they need meds. Also i'm very concern about overstocking - i think i'm putting too much into the 240 (i call it a 240 since it is a 180 with a 60 gallon sump). I can't tell the size of your aquarium but it is definitely less populated.I'm quite late to this thread but I dropped by to say hi to Larry. You may or may not remember me but we've communicated before on simplydiscus many many years ago.
For what it's worth, my wild discus quarantine process is more or less identical to Larry's. Granted I haven't kept wild discus in a few years, but I first started the wild discus hobby about 15 years ago (much less than Larry) and other than 2 years dabbling in reefs and another 2 years with Tanganyikan cichlids, I've always kept wildcaught South American cichlids including a wide number of Geophagus and Satanoperca species, and true blackwater species that are reputedly hard to keep like panda uarus, altum angels, etc.
I can respect the philosophy not to use medication unnecessarily, but in my mind wildcaught fish always come with both internal and external parasites - it's just a matter of to what degree they are infected - so medication will always be necessary with these fish. Of course if you can trust either your importer or exporter to have done the necessary quarantine process and kept the fish clean thereafter then there's no need to do it yourself. It's up to you how much you trust them of course.
This is a tank of Curuai red (species is S. haraldi, the brown/blue discus) that I kept back in 2012:
View attachment 14329
P.S. I note that you've been referring to your discus orders as "royals" and "cametas" as though they are different subsets of the same thing. Just to be pedantic, "royal" refers to a colour morph of the fish, describing that it has a full body of blue striations over the brown base (usually describing S. haraldi but i've seen it used on S. aquafasciatus before too). "Semiroyal" would describe only partial body coverage of the blue striations (many dishonest sellers sell semiroyals as royals to jack up the price so ge careful of what you pay for). Then there are other descriptions tagged along like "ica type" or "wide middle bar", "red base", etc. An on topic example would be a red bellied A. elizabethae.
On the other hand "Cameta" is the locality or name of the river or lake that the discus was caught from. It may or may not be a real location because of marketing or other reasons. Example here would be Ivanacara adoketa from Sao Gabriel. Certain localities have alleged predisposition to certain patterns, like Cuipeua is known for bright red clean bodied discus with no striations at all, the Alenquer region in general is known for Red based discus and the Xingu region is known for yellow based discus. However, my view is that this is to some extent marketing. I've seen semiroyal discus from Cuipeua and dull brown discus from both Alenquer and Xingu. I've also seen bright red discus from outside Alenquer.
So it is possible for you to obtain a royal from cameta - they're not mutually exclusive. Ultimately they're just different varieties (pattern wise or locality wise) of the same species of discus Symphysodon haraldi. But this may be a discussion for another time or thread
the importer said he treated them for 4 weeks; i'll take pictures of the new 6 before i release them in a couple of weeks. Right now (3 days); one of the 6 is staying very dark but otherwise i havent' see any issues - they are much more lively than the first 4 - clamp fins or other marking on the body haven't been an issue with any of the 10. The one remaining dark might be due to pecking order or perhaps as you said might be related to health issue.If I didn't know for sure that the importer/exporter did the exact quarantine procedure that I would do myself, I would just go ahead and do it myself. That's the bar I set for myself and my fish. I have not found any of my wildcaught fish to react adversely to standard anti parasite medicines.
Thereafter I would observe for any other telltale signs in behavior or physical symptoms like perpetually clamped fins, perpetual huddling in a corner, black or white external spots, fungus or fungus like growths, red streaks or patches and in discus being perpetually dark and if they exhibit any of those symptoms I would then treat appropriately. If you observe any such symptoms and are not confident in diagnosing then bring it to the forums with as much detail as possible, preferably with pictures and videos. I don't think anyone can help much with just a "can you see anything wrong here?" question as that would be to general in nature to be able to tell.
This is just my opinion personally, others may have different views
I'm not a Discus keeper, but I know it isn't a good sign. @Apistomaster is your best bet for some informed comment.Some of them have a bit of deformity around the face - this is the worse one - the area is sort of pushed in and the eyes enlarged (runtish?);
Do you think @Apistomaster will respond? Also should we rename him Discusmaster ?Hi all,
I'm not a Discus keeper, but I know it isn't a good sign. @Apistomaster is your best bet for some informed comment.
cheers Darrel