Responding to Cathy G.Sorry click on wrong button.

[happy]

Too hard for me to move.I type with one finger lol.

I started stocking a 55 gallon and my stocking plans were keeping 8-9 Dwarfs and my Thicked lipped gourami and mini pleco or two.Breeding was not a priority. When these two spawned i removed the other fish.Tank cycled Nov 11. PH 7.0-7.1 am-0-ni-0-na-10.Looks like the pair are Mikrogeophagus ramirezi -gold. The eggs 300+ were laid in a small red clay pot.All were fertilized.The male guarded them 98% of the time fanning .The female came and took them i think and put them on leaves i think.Then 2 1/2 to 4 days they floated to the top hatched as wigglers 300 of them wiggled and fell into the gravel .I did not see any sight of them in the gravel then or now..Yesterday was day 7 and that`s when they started swimming to the top.They started fron the gravel as little yolk types and then wiggled into a head and little tail. They hit the top swam down about 2-3 inches then went back up where they just stayed there.Then they went poff and turned into vapour i think after a while.I thought they were looking for food or something.

The filter is an Eihem Pro 2324. The flow was turned down so that the yolk could pretty much go straight up.I tried today to siphon some out with 1/2 in hose and catch some with a cup but they were too fragile,no luck.I`m guessing to much stress somehow?I don`t think i am going to see any more free swimmers.

I set up a 10g barebottom today with tank water,sponge filter with air control valve.Ran the Emperor 280 from my 25 g for an hour on it.I will pick up some java moss tommorow. The tank perams are 7.1-0-0-10 and i`m sure they will stay stable.will test in 24 and 48 hours

They are getting ready to spawn again.They are in a 55g by themselves.Well planted with lots of rock structure.The female has eggs and the male was chasing her around.They have been swimming for the most part right in the front of the tank for the last 3 hours!With the plant lights off the colors on them are bright orange noses then bright yellow then the back half is a glowing blue.The male may be changing strategy he`s digging at the gravel right up front.

Should i give then another chance in 55g and try to move half the eggs to 10 g or just just move them if the perams stay stable in the 10 g?

Ps.I have read every post from the last year on this breeding forum trying to educate myself.

 

[fishgeek]

for them to float to the surface from hatching is not normal
and i cant see how all fry would have a swim bladder issue at birth

andrew

 

[Cathy G]

Hi Happy, this floating to the top is very strange - I have never seen this happen...

I wrote up very complete directions on artificially hatching blue and bolivian rams. I'll include a link to my home page and if you click on the lower right link you'll find my hugely detailed write ups for newbees. (Lessons I learned were from the school of hard knocks!)

There could be a couple of things going on with your rams, they are young and whatever 'glue' from the female which anchors the eggs to the rock or gravel didn't seem to work. Perhaps she wasn't close enough to the rock when she layed them, or perhaps she does have some infertility issues...

You have to decide if you want to artificially hatch and rear eggs. It is work... and not as much fun as watching the parents do it. (Most parents these days have lost their ability to do it....) Since you have just observed one spawn, I think I'd watch another one or two and see what happens then. Perhaps they will get it together and make it work.

You said:

I set up a 10g barebottom today with tank water,sponge filter with air control valve.Ran the Emperor 280 from my 25 g for an hour on it.I will pick up some java moss tommorow. The tank perams are 7.1-0-0-10 and i`m sure they will stay stable.will test in 24 and 48 hours

The sponge filter needs to be well seeded. This should be running in the parent tank and not removed until there is food to feed it in the 10g. All the beneficial bacteria will die off unless fed. Running another external filter on the 10 for a while is not going to work because in a fry tank the bacteria live mainly on the sponge filter, and not in the water column. So, leave the sponge in the parent tank, either running it with an air pump or stuff the sponge itself into the filter box. You won't be using it until you get free swimmers.

If you place the eggs to hatch in this 10g tank, you'll have to add something to the water which will prevent fungus from setting in and destroying them. This is usually hydrogen peroxide, or meth. blue. Either one of these will be harmful to the plants and the infusoria which the live plants bring in. So, don't add the plants until the eggs hatch into wigglers...

If you read my write up, this will help you understand what has to be done. And, the order I do it in... I am sure there are plenty of other good ways, but this was how I finally experienced success with ram fry.

Oh, if you have been looking very very closely, you might be seeing the their egg shells float off. The wigglers break out of a tiny tiny clear egg shell, these float off into space. The wiggler's have a built in yolk sac which feeds them internally for those first few days. Then they lift off the bottom in controled movements and start swimming around looking for something to munch on.

Hope this helps, you can pm/email me if you have any questions.
Cathy G
http://www.cathygeier.com

 

[happy]

Hi Cathy G
I printed of you link.Pretty sure i read your link before.First thing i need to do is get a gh-kh test kit.

The yolk things that floated to the top it is pretty safe to say they were bbs.The only way i could see them is with 3.5x reading glasses.I added a squirt with a turkey baster from my first hatchery on day 6 after the eggs hatched.The hatchery was about 1 gallon of salt-marine salt water in a small tub that i used a hydrometer to get the salt- water content.With airstone and i had problems try to stabalize the temp at around 80.So i did not really know what the bbs hatches looked like.

It is very safe to say the rams eggs 200-300 hatched into wigglers on about day 3 fell into the gravel but never got any further.I will try to get gh-kh reading tommorow.I watched the spawn.They cleaned the small clay pot for about 15 minutes.Then took turns swimming in and out for about 90 minutes.The eggs were brownish after that.About 1/3 stuck to the side of the clay pot the rest were laying on the bottom.Today would be day 9 since then..I have seen 4 or 5 larger wigglers swimming around the tank the last two days but they get stuck to the glass.They do not look like free swimmers although i have never seen one.Still a small chance i will see one on this batch.