Keeping large numbers of apistos to work with

[aarhud]

Hello,

When you are growing out a fairly large group of apistos, how do you keep them all once they hit sexually maturity? Will a bare tank of all males, or all females fuss and fight if there are no territories?

I want to raise a few spawns and select males with colors and features I like. But How do I grow up 10+ after they hit sexually maturity.

I run into this problem with a lot of fish in general. Tank space is at a premium, but I would like more than just a single pair to insure I have replacements if something bad happens.

 

[tjudy]

In my opinion.... crowd them and do not give them structures that are easy to defend. Ten male apistos in a bare ten gallon tank will probably not hurt each other.

 

[aarhud]

Thanks Ted,

I was not sure if my question made sense at first.

 

[Mike Wise]

I agree with Ted. This not only means no territories to defend but makes the fish less secure, being in the open, and spreads the aggression.

 

[gerald]

Keep in mind though that the genetically "best" looking fish might not be the biggest or fastest growing. A really nice fish (genetically) that you'd want to keep as a breeder might not look like much if he's suppressed by dominant fish.

 

[Dzo]

I had them in the way Ted and Mike explained, bare tank and lots of fish. I would recommend at least 12+ fish depending on species since in smaller numbers the smallest and weakest fish tend to suffer a lot.
But I also had them in a very, very planted aquariums also very crowded and this seems like an even better idea. Plants made a jungle hard to penetrate, the movement was very limiting in there and the smaller, weaker fish easy evaded bigger more agrressive one, so the fish felt secure and stressless. Plus the plants made water quality better absorbing all the Nitro solutions. You might have problem feeding them in such tank. I had a small open space on one side where I lured all the fish and fed them at the same time every day.

 

[aarhud]

I'm after some wild cacatuoides and I was interested in seeing the variability in males. So I'm not really shooting for a best male or anything.

I run into this same issue with a lot of my fish. Wrong forum, but I like to keep extra Cryptoheros that I'm working with as well. Guess I'll just have to experiment with the bare tank method.

 

[gerald]

I like Dzo's idea - crowded fish AND crowded with plants. I suspect more fish will show their colors under those conditions than in a bare tank where there's no place to hide from the dominant fish.

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

But I also had them in a very, very planted aquariums also very crowded and this seems like an even better idea. Plants made a jungle hard to penetrate, the movement was very limiting in there and the smaller, weaker fish easy evaded bigger more agrressive one, so the fish felt secure and stressless. Plus the plants made water quality better absorbing all the Nitro solutions. You might have problem feeding them in such tank. I had a small open space on one side where I lured all the fish and fed them at the same time every day.

I do this, if you feed a lot of small live food items (Grindal worms, BBS, Daphnia) all the fish will eat. It works very well for A. cactuoides, but it didn't work as well for A. trifasciata, because the males are much more aggressive, even as sub-adults.

The major problem was retrieving them, I had to take the whole tank apart to get them all out.

cheers Darrel

 

[Mike Wise]

This is where I use a fish trap made from a soda bottle. If you make the opening in the cap only large enough for juveniles to enter, it works great. Just add some live bbs to the trap and walk away for an hour or two.

 

[raymond82]

I tried making a fish trap once but I couldn't really get it to work. I cut a 1.5 L soda bottle and put the top upside down in the bottom part creating sort of a funnel. I left it in the aquarium for very long time (days I think) but no fish entered. I tried with red mosquito larvae inside though, not BBS. Does it matter a lot what type of bottle I use?

It would be so great having a working fish trap, now every time I dismantle the whole aquarium which also causes a lot of stress for the fish (and for me too).

 

[aarhud]

You would probably need a smaller trap, but I have used 2 liter bottles with Nannacara. If there are only a few fish in the tank it may take awhile, since the bottle tends to make them timid. The more fish that go pecking around the bottle, the braver they get.

 

[raymond82]

I'll give it a go again, I keep most of my tanks with at lot of decoration and it's always hell to get the fry out. Right now I don't have fry that needs to be removed but soon as I while I'll try again with the bottle. After trying before I had given up on it, thinking that it doesn't work but listening to your stories I should try again.

 

[Mike Wise]

I use ½ pint/250 ml water bottles. I drill a 3/8"/1 cm hole in the cap (prevents any adults from entering) and fill it with live BBS. Place it in the same location every day. I usually don't get many juveniles the first day or 2, but after that more juveniles find it.

 

[raymond82]

Thanks for the clarification, I will try doing it like this. I guess a bit of patience is required...

 

[raymond82]

This maybe a silly question, but does it matter what orientation the bottle is in (vertical or horizontal)?

 

[Mike Wise]

Horizontal, the same orientation as the fish.

 

[JasonC]

Tried it myself for the first time today and it worked like a charm! within 2 hours of the bottle being in the tank, I pulled 20+ A. sp. "Kelleri", and there were as many surrounding the bottle that had not figured out how to make it in. This is definitely a trick worth trying... I was *dreading* having to catch these guys as they grew out.

Thanks!!

 

[raymond82]

I tried it too today, works great! Just have to keep an eye on them, soon as the fish finished the BBS they quickly found their way out again!