Is my male safe in a breeding tank?

[apistonewbie]

Please do as MacZ suggest. Treat with only one of the medications at a time for the recommended period. You don't want to stress your fish more than necessary.

Doing just that! My local store didn’t have anything that listed those ingredients directly on the bottle but got a “parasite remedy” and a “bacterial infection remedy”, both from the brand imagitarium as when I googled those chemicals it came up with those two

 

[apistonewbie]

Please do as MacZ suggest. Treat with only one of the medications at a time for the recommended period. You don't want to stress your fish more than necessary.

I’m currently using the parasite one every other day as it directs. How many times should I use that one before trying the other one?

 

[MacZ]

Do a big waterchange and return the unopened bottle.

Parasite remedy contains citrus oil, neem oil and tagetes oil. I use neem to keep fungus gnats from my tomatoes and cannabis plants, but it won't help your fish.

Same for the other one, which contains also citrus oil and neem oil with additional Eucalyptus oil.

All these ingredients can't get into the fish, where they would be needed, nor would they help if the fish could absorb them.

Look into this list. I hope there's something available to you listed.

Vendors | BSAVA Library

Appendix III: Proprietary fish medicine vendors Trade name Active ingredients Active against Fresh/marine Manufacturer’s comments API, USA — 0800 014 8173 — www.apifishcare.co.uk Melafix Cajeput oil Bacteria F+M Safe for invertebrates Pond Melafix Cajeput oil Bacteria F Safe for invertebrates...

www.bsavalibrary.com

 

[apistonewbie]

Heard that same advice from a smaller local store and got one he said would be much better for actively targeting the fish

 

[MacZ]

I don't know that explicit product, but it has the right ingredrients and the instructions are excellent.

Just one thing: Do NOT use a hospital tank, because in this case all fish will be affected, so treat them in situ!

 

[KenL]

So, parasitic treatments sold to treat fish are no good for fish? Is there no regulation in the industry?

 

[MacZ]

In the US and Asia there are little to no regulations.
There are many products that do nothing and are just snake oil. Many avoid calling it a med or a drug, then, but the past few years when I look the stuff up many dropped that and still used terms that made people think it's a real medication.
There are also many that are complete overkill containing the hardest stuff you can find, that will nuke the whole microbiome in the tank. Those would require dilution and the use of a hospital tank, but people are not told that and many just want something that kills everything.

In the EU, UK, Canada and Australia many of the snake oils are also available but the hard stuff is heavily regulated. The fakes are not allowed to call themselves medical or have to somehow legally make sure people can't make them responsible if it doesn't work. Often there's a mild active ingredient in much too low concentrarion in it and 99% are just water. On the other hand you won't get antibiotics, effective dewormers and many other agents that are scientifically proven to work without a prescription. Provided you get one, because at least in Europe there are very few practicing veterinarians specialized in fish and if not specialized they hesitate to treat fish or right out refuse to help. The regulations on the hard stuff are due to general regulations of reducing antibiotic overuse (which I support) and specific regulations concerning fish (which I start to support less and less). The specific ones do not distinguish ornamental fish from food fish, so the stuff got mostly prohibited to protect consumers of food fish. Too bad for keepers of ornamental fish. About 80% of the stuff I recommend here is not available over the counter where I live.

Also often they will tell you what I've come to say a lot: Is it worth it trying to save a 5€ fish paying about 100€ just for a single consultation plus an extra 50€ for the med, if the odds are against you because the fish is beyond saving by the time all is done and paid? Rather get a bottle of clove oil which is a good choice to put fish down.

So my rule of thumb: If there are no ingredients printed on the bottle and you have to look them up and then it's at best just some herbal stuff that won't do anthing but cost you money, so don't buy it.

 

[anewbie]

expel-p is commonly used in the usa (just confirming it isn't snake oil) the problem is there are two types of parasite and expel-p is only effective against one (i forget the active ingrediant/product for the other type as it is less common).

 

[apistonewbie]

I don't know that explicit product, but it has the right ingredrients and the instructions are excellent.

Just one thing: Do NOT use a hospital tank, because in this case all fish will be affected, so treat them in situ!

Made sure to treat within the tank and did the instructed water change after 24 hours. The water still has some whiteness to it and the male apisto doesn’t seem to have improved. What should next steps be?

 

[MacZ]

Wait. Repeat once, then as instructed again in a week.

If there is no change 2 days after that, you will need a med against intestinal protozoan. I gave you the list. Ask before you go and buy, then go for it.

 

[Kj3LL]

I’m not quite sure, but here is a pic

This comes from anaerobic substrate. I use snails to air the sand.

 

[Kj3LL]

This comes from anaerobic substrate. I use snails to air the sand.

Looks like the sand is too fine also. This will trap gases that when released in bubbles it is harmful for livestock

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

I use snails to air the sand.

I have Malaysian Trumpet Snail (Melanoides tuberculata) in all my tanks where the water is hard enough for them.

Looks like the sand is too fine also.

I use very fine "play sand" and I've never had any problem with it <"https://apistogramma.com/forum/threads/hth-pool-filter-sand-for-agassizii.25838/#post-128536">.

cheers Darrel

 

[MacZ]

Looks like the sand is too fine also. This will trap gases that when released in bubbles it is harmful for livestock

Well, if the sand layer is too thick (significantly over 5cm) anoxic zones may occur, but they don't have to. Also there is no "too fine" for sand in a dwarf cichlid tank. It can be almost silt with a grain size of merely 0.1 to 0.5 mm without problems. And I can guarantee you, many snails do not do well in water as soft and acidic as many of us use in their tanks. You're not wrong for a tapwater-using community tank, but even then it's not as critical as many people think.