Pelvicachromis sp. aff. pulcher - p. "Sacrimontis" - Advise?

[YngUrbanCMH]

I found someone in my local area with 6 young Giant Krib's. I'm not sure where I'm going to put them yet, but it's so difficult to find interesting species in my area so I can't say no!

How large of a tank would everyone recomend for these guys? I could make some room in my 10 gallon at work, which should be ok short term I think... being young all of them are under 2". My other option is to stick them in my 30 gallon which already has a pair of p.pulcher.

I could also purchase another aquarium... which means I'd need to get it running ASAP! I've heard of people seeding their filter by sticking it in an established tank and other methods of getting a tank running quickly... anybody have any pointers?

Any suggestions?
Thanks a bunch!
John

Thanks!

 

[tjudy]

Pel. sacrimontis, IME, can be brutal on each other. If you get all of them and put them in a ten, I would set up another tank in anticipation of a pair showing up in the ten.

I kept a pair in a 33L, which is a 48x13x13 tank. The males get larger than most kribs, and can beat up a female in confined space if he is ready and she is not. I kept an end of the tank set up with piled rocks with small opening for her to escape to. After a couple spawns he was the perfect gentleman. I would not want to keep a pair in less than a standard 30 or 40 gallon.

If you do get a pair, placing a subdominant fish in the tank with them can help cement the pair. It will get beat.. likely to death... but the result could ber a more productive pair.

Good luck

 

[Ghazanfar Ghori]

I think... being young all of them are under 2". My other option is to stick them in my 30 gallon which already has a pair of p.pulcher.

Don't mix different subspecies together - they'll interbreed.

I could also purchase another aquarium... which means I'd need to get it running ASAP! I've heard of people seeding their filter by sticking it in an established tank and other methods of getting a tank running quickly... anybody have any pointers?

You can seed another tank by sqeezing the gunk from an established
filter into the water column. The 'virgin' filter will clean out this
gunk from the water column and in doign that will seed itself. Toss a few
fish in, give it a week just to be safe and it should be good to go.
Make sure you test for ammonia and nitrite to be 100% sure that
its cycled.

 

[tjudy]

Don't mix different subspecies together - they'll interbreed.

Mixnign sub-species or races is probably not a good idea, but I do not think that this would happen readily between sacrimontis and pulcher. They are very different fish, IMO. The males are especially different in their size, shape and behavior.

I still would not mix them though.

 

[YngUrbanCMH]

I probably won't mix them then. I may short term have to use a tank divider so I have some place to stick these little guys for a couple of days.

 

[Randall]

Pelvicachromis sacrimontis

Dear John,

Pelvicachromis sacrimontis get somewhat larger than P. pulcher. With six coming your way, I wouldn't put them in anything smaller than a 55-gallon tank; and when they start growing, even that might prove too small. After pairs start forming, it might be a good idea to remove the dominant pair to separate quarters, say a 20-long tank or better.

I don't see a problem housing P. sacrimontis and P. pulcher together. The two species are quite distinct from one another, so there shouldn't be much of a hybridization risk...but, then again, your fish haven't read the same books that I have.

Should you run out and buy a new tank set up, seeding it with gravel from an established tank, using filter media from a filter currently in use or Ghazanfar's suggestion should all speed up the cycling process. Another alternative is get yourself a package of Marineland Labs' brand Bio-Spira. I've tested this cycling product on a virgin tank at home, and it works.

Good luck with your new acquisitions.

All the best,

Randall Kohn

 

[YngUrbanCMH]

Randall,
Have you had good luck with bio spira? I used it in my 10 gallon at work, and still had ammonia and nitrite readings... I followed the directions on the package adding a 1oz packet that is supposed to treat up to 30 gallons. Someone suggested that you are supposed to continually add it?

 

[Randall]

Bio-Spira

Hi John,

When Bio-Spira first hit the market last year, I didn't believe the manufacturer's claims, so I tried it out. Using a virgin 20-gallon setup with some wood, plants and seven small cichlids, I added 1 oz. of the product and had no ammonia or nitrite for the first four weeks. Afterward, I stopped testing. A small Eheim canister filter was used on this setup.

One Marineland Lab rep told me not to overstock, otherwise the product would not be effective.

As far as I know, one dose is supposed to be sufficient. If one had to keep adding it, given its price, I don't think it would be worth it.

Good luck!

Randall Kohn

 

[YngUrbanCMH]

Thanks Randall!
I gave it another try. I just started a Tang. Shellie tank in a 20g Long that I picked up for a steal. Just to be safe, on top of using BioSpira I also filled up a media bag with gravel from another of my established tanks, and some texas holy rock from my krib tank. I figured the holy rock being so pourous would have alot of surface area for good bacteria. I have minimal ammonia and nitrite readings after 5 days, but nothing that I'm too concerned about yet.

BTW, I've been told by my significant other if I get another tank anytime soon... it had better be big enough for me to sleep in

 

[Daphnia]

I just picked up six adult "wild" sacrimontis at Thursday night's Greater Akron Aquarium Society meeting. They had been from a Mystery Box from The Fish Place in Buffalo, NY. If I were to guess at the sex and leave a pair of the most male-looking and most female-looking in the 120 and put the other four in the 165, does it sound like a viable plan? The pH is now about 7.2. How low does it have to go (5.5?)and any suggestions how? Can I just let it drift back down to about 5 where it had been staying? I just replaced the gravel in the 165 with Flourite, so it's essentially a new tank, but with the plants and driftwood back in. The largest fish are some Siamese Algae eaters and black tetras. Then there are small tetras (mostly rummy noses) and harlequin rasboras and a variety of small catfish, whiptail, L114, a dozen C. aeneus, two dozen otocinclus. All that's in the 120 is a huge potted swordplant that totally fills the tank, and a breeding pair of silver angels.

 

[YngUrbanCMH]

They don't seem to be too picky about pH, although I once triggered a pair of regular old pelvicachromis pulcher to spawn by doing a 20% water change with RO water, lowering the pH from about 7.0 to 6.8 and dramatically reducing my hardness. I've not been brave enough to deal with pH ranges in the 5s... I hear that the nitrogen cycle pretty much ceases and you have to rely on extremely regular water changes to maintain low NH3 and NO2 levels.

You might find that a pair develops faster by putting all six in the tank, you may lose a fish but it seems like competition in conjunction with other fish for a pair to beat up increases the chances of breeding. Once you find a pair have spawned you could remove the others. With a tank that size (I think you were talking about gallons) you might even be lucky enough to have more than one pair... but others may share different experiences.

 

[Randall]

Pelvicachromis sacrimontis Husbandry

Dear Daphnia,

I agree with YngUrbanCMH in that given the size of your tanks, you might place all six in one and see what develops. In time, a dominant pair will emerge and can be removed to separate quarters for spawning then.

As for water chemistry, with P. sacrimontis sex ratios are effected by pH. I'd recommend that you soften your water utilizing either peat moss or an R/O unit and bring the pH down to 6.0-6.5. Given that your fish are wild caught and were originally collected in soft, acidic water; they should respond well, show brilliant coloration and spawn.

Good luck with them. I think P. sacrimontis are one of the most beautiful fish endemic to western Africa.

All the best,

Randall Kohn

 

[YngUrbanCMH]

I've had good luck with Seachem Discus Buffer ph5.0. It both adjusts pH to 5.8-6.8 and softens water by precipitating calcium and magnesium.... I use it in conjunction with a water softening pillow in my 10 gallon breeder. I live in a relatively small loft apartment, so don't have room for an R/O unit nor do I feel like toting buckets of R/O water upstairs from a store.

 

[Daphnia]

Yougurban, The SeaChem sounds like a good plan to me. I do most water changes with distilled water, until the pH drops around 5, then use Cleveland tap. The plants and driftwood seem partly responsible. Although I did not return the largest piece of swamp driftwood (54" X 20") to the tank, I still expect they will have an effect. Most of the pieces came from a swamp near Baton Rouge, LA and they seem to acidify the water.

 

[Neil]

Daphnia,

WELCOME TO THE FORUM

I would steer clear of chemical additives to manipulate pH unless truely needed. Sounds like you are doing fine mixing your DI with tap. If you can get Randalls suggested desired results that way, that is what I would do.

Neil