Pathetic spawning?

[Got_milk?]

Hi,

Just got a pair of A. Baenschi about a month ago, hoping to get them to breed (fascinated by the way Apistos care for their young).

After about 2+ weeks of waiting, I finally saw a wriggler! Yes, that's ONE whole baby fish! :x

Needless to say, odds were not in it's favour and it was gone after 3 days. Not to be beatened, I gave the female a larger cave to hide it (well it's a larger PVC tube section) and they soon went at it again.

Guess what, I saw eggs in the PVC tube today. FIVE WHOLE EGGS!!! :evil:

Now correct me if I am wrong, aren't apisto egg clutches supposed to be quite large? In the range of 30 +++ ?

Anyone experienced poor spawning (in terms of numbers) and know what causes it? I will be grateful of any help!

Oh yeah, after hearing from fellow apisto enthusiasts, I thought that the female would raise hell once they spawned. Apparently, for some strange reason, they are still getting along and even flirting! Surprising too, the male is helping to drive off anything that comes too close. Is this normal?

My tank info:

1.5" tank
18W daylight
26-27 deg C
pH 6-6.8 (buffered with Bullseye 6.5 and supplemented by pH Down)
1' ocean free substrate
Daily water top up
Monthly 1/3 water change

Flora:
Java moss
X'mas moss
Unknown moss
Algae!

Fauna:
Amano shrimps x 3
Oto
Diamond head neon tetra x 6 (quarantined in case they attack the fries)

Male territory : half a coconut shell
Female territoy : 1' diameter PVC tube + tiny flower pot

 

[Zapisto]

are they young fish ?

 

[Got_milk?]

The male's about 4.5cm, female's about 3.5cm

Not sure how old that is.

BTW, they are supposed to be wild caught, not sure if that's significant

 

[Apistt_ed]

..

hello, got milk?,
At 3.5 - 4 cm, they are still what I would say to be young fish learning. From that, I would say that they will have a large spawn once they get a little more "practice". Apistos productivity, how large their spawns are, are dependant on many things such as age as i said earlier, diet, and how well you can emulate their natural habitat for optimum outcome. Because your fish are wild and young, they are only going to improve with time(the # of eggs and the # of them that develope). Many eggs may have been laid by the female, but only a few of them may have actually developed as I suspect is what has happened. Your water parameters are good (hardness/acidity), but may need to be lowered a little to achieve greater hatch rates, maybe filtering peat could help or R/O water added at water changes. With the water being changed at 30 % each month or so, you may want to change this to 20% every other week. What are you feeding your fish also? Protein rich diet can correspond to how many eggs are produced by the female also. In this situation, live foods are best and an absolute must! Live brine shrimp, CBWs (black worms), diced earthworms, and so on have been proven great foods to fatten the females up to produce the large spawns of 30-250 eggs. There are much more things that can lead to small spawns and I have seen out of about 140 aggie fry, only 3 survivors which actually got to the 1cm mark. It's all how nature sees fit. Chances are your fish may be young and persistence will pay off as long as it's helped with a little patience. I hope this has helped a little...
john

 

[cootwarm]

I've read where some apistos eggs have trouble developing when the water is too hard. I've also read that pH buffers increase the hardness or conductivity (which is related).

Perhaps there is a connection there? What is your hardness? The parents will eat any unfertilized or dead eggs.

Michael

 

[Got_milk?]

Thanks for the replies.

Ed: Most of the time I feed them frozen brine shrimp. Blood worms are too messy and they don't care for any pellet food. I would like to feed them live food but it's hard to go down to the LFS every so often to restock.

But 250 eggs in a clutch? that's simply amazing!!!

Sad to say, I can't even see the 5 eggs anymore. The female might have knocked them off their perch, if so, will they still hatch?

cootwarm: Right now I am not keeping track of my hardness. What's a good value?

 

[Mike Wise]

John & Michael have given you some good information. A. baenschi is a very prolific apisto. Spawns of over 100 fry are commonly reported. Your fish are young and compatible, so you have a lot of spawns ahead.

First of all, like Michael states, many apisto breeders have noticed a major drop in production with increased conductivity in the water. Adding chemical buffers & additives only increases the conductivity. If possible do as John suggests. Use some peat filtered water in your tank to lower the pH. It will not only acidify your water but soften it, too. I do not recommend "top up" of a breeding aquarium. This only leads to the water becoming more hard, with increased conductivity. Weekly 20-30% water changes are much better.

Speaking of tanks you write that you have a 1.5" tank. Obviously you don't mean inches. If this is a 1.5 foot-long tank (typically a 5½ gallon tank) you will find this much too small for your pair.

 

[Peter Lovett1]

I have learnt with this fish that Hardness does play a part in them being able to successfully spawn. I have had in my time 5 wild fish on two occasions each having two male and three female all the females have spawn at one time or another and I have had numerous F1 spawns some at some with the female only being about .5â€Â.

When I got my original 5 they where in a tank with a high TDS of aabout 180ppm out of the thee females in the tank one female had very large broods one female had broods of no more than 20 and one never produced any fry what so ever. They where move after about 12 months to a tank with a TTS of 40ppm and a ph of less than 6. The brood sizes in these parameters where almost equal at about 50 to 75 fry for each spawn.

My other 5 wild fish purchased 18 months after the first 5 are spawning find in the same water as above.

When it comes to the size of the tank I would just like to say that may be unlike most Apistogramma they do appear to have a closer pair bond than you see in others and I have kept a number of F1 pairs in a tanks of about that size and they have spawned a number of times in the last 6 months with on sign of any problems. Though I would not advise anyone to put an unspawned pair in a tank of that size.

When it comes to feeding I feed mostly flake I just make sure it sinks and don't worry if they do not eat it straight away because they will find it and for them to search for there food is more natural anyway.

 

[Got_milk?]

Mike, Peter,

Thanks for your advice. Maybe I should start monitoring my water hardness as you have mentioned.

About the feet and inches thing, my bad, where I am we use cm... so ermmm... heh

Right now, it seems that the few eggs did hatch after all as both parents are looking after a few wrigglers, I will just leave them undisturbed as it is. I will see what I can do after this batch of fries.