New to dwarfs

[Robertb1979]

Hi everyone, I would like to know what dwarf cichlids are good to start with. My wife already keeps Kribs and we are planning to start a 4 foot tank with a few community fish and dwarf cichlids.

We both like the Apistogramma species and want to know what would be good for beginners, and would Rams make good tank mate as the share similar water preferences. I am not keen on the Bolivian ram though.

Our tap water is about pH 7.2 and the hardness is 10oGH from the tap but does get lower as our tank is well planted and we use CO2.

This is a long term plan so we can plan such gadgetry as RO units to be put in place before the fish arrive.

Does using either a peat or leaf substrate have much of an effect to the tank pH and soft/hardness as this is also an option as this would need to be a planted aquarium.

Also any other advice on what i should be doing would be helpfull. I prefer to know exactly what mess i am getting myself into maintenance wise etc.

Many thanks

Rob

 

[Peter Lovett1]

Well if i was you i would probably try A. Cacatuoides or A. borellii as they are not very demanding and will also breed in the water that you have.

I would however stay away from Rams they are not the easiest of fish to keep.

If you get an RO system then this will open up your choose of fish. Most Apistogramma are quite easy to keep as long as the water soft and has a Ph of about 6 or 6.5

Rams will also do better in the above water.

Peat and Leaf Litter will have the same affect and will drop the hardness and the pH though peat is better at doing this. But leaf look real cool in a tank.

The only other thing to remember is to put in plenty of hiding places

 

[Robertb1979]

Thanks for answering Peter.

How aggressive are these two species (A. Cacatuoides or A. borellii) as I have many community fish such as barbs, danios and tetras and rainbowfish.

If they were to spawn would they have the ability to defend the young? This is one of the reasons that we like Kribs and rams as both parents defend the young.

Also what would be the best way of stocking this tank (4x2x2). Would 2 males even of different species be problematic. (is there behaviour like the mbuna where more fish = less problems)

And my final question (for now) is do you know where I can find pictures of tanks with leaf litter. I have never seen it and never really considered its aesthetical properties just that it would lower the pH and hardness.

Many thanks again

Rob

 

[chapman76]

Cacs and borelli are as mild mannered of apistos as you'll find. All apistogramma will defend their young. They're not quite as nasty as kribs, but they'll handle anything that comes near their fry/eggs.

I can't help you with a picture of leaf substrate. Cacs and borelli don't need to have a lower PH, they'll breed in neutral PH.

I personally don't really think any apisto or ram is hard to keep as long as you do your research and provide the proper environment. I was a total novice and the cichlid I ever got was an A. Nijsseni. My female has tried to breed, but I have no male right now. I am just waiting for one. Some apistos are more aggresive than others. My dominant female killed one of my panda corys because it got too close to the eggs.

 

[Peter Lovett1]

When not breeding and even then Apistogramma are not that aggressive other than to there own kind. Out of the two specie you mention A Borellii is the most peaceful. Cramming does work with dwarf cichlids but unlike mbuna it does stop the fish from breeding successfully.

If you really want to keep more than one Male in your tank then i would try getting 4 male and about 6 female. Borellii and try to get them small no more than 1" or 1.5" and try your best to get males of the same size.

If you want the fish to breed and raise there young then try to have dither fish that are slow with small mouths and do not grow more than an 1.5" and do not spend much time near the bottom of the tank. The best fish to put with them would be pencils and Ruby nosed tetras and may be if you have to have a barb you could go for cherry barbs.

Your tank should have plenty of hiding place so lots of caves and bog wood slate is also good the top inch of your substate shoul be sand of about 1 to 2mm as they do like to dig and will spend a lot of there time sifting the sand to find food.

When it comes to leaf litter all i can say is give it a go and if you dont like it take it out.

Could i also ask where you are.

 

[BigDaddy]

I keep a pair of german blue rams with a pair of apisto panduro in a 25 gallon tank. No problems with agresssion. Other tankmates include black neons and cardinals, SAEs ottos and some juvenille keyholes.

The keyholes are getting their own tank very soon, but otherwise the two pair of cichlids get along just fine.

 

[Robertb1979]

Hi Peter,
In answer to your question i am in Staffordshire. There is a very limited number of shops that stock cichlids round here. Most of our 'shopping' trips involve either very long trips (BAS in Bolton was one of the few worth the drive) or local experienced aquarists that have bread their fish and set up fish rooms etc.

Could I mix 2 males of the different species in the same tank (2 of each). I have also been recommended A. macmasteri, what are your opinions on this fish.

The community fish mentioned are already doing well in another tank and if they are likely to be problematic they will stay there rather than being moved.

Thanks for the help.

Rob

 

[Neil]

Robertb1979,

WELCOME TO THE FORUM

Although the advise so far has been very good, you have many more options than have already been discussed. There are a large amount of Dwarf Cichlid species that can be put into your tank, especially if you reduce the hardness a touch. As Peter said:

If you get an RO system then this will open up your choose of fish. Most Apistogramma are quite easy to keep as long as the water soft and has a Ph of about 6 or 6.5

Just about all of them. Bur breeding is a different story. So I suggest you see what your availability is and determine what you like from what you can get. Then post again and maybe we can give you further direction.

One last thing... Males will probably be fine together because they have less reason for aggression when not breeding, but why limit 75% of the behaviors that make Dwarf Cichlids so interesting. Whether you get fry or not is less important than the show that goes with having males and females from a couple of different species (which is about all that you should keep in a 4 ft. tank).

Good luck,

Neil

 

[Robertb1979]

Cheers Neil

I was only going to have one species of appisto but Rams and Kribs really not suitable. I an not really interested in the breeding as much as the behaviour, we have friends that keep mbuna and the tank is much more fun than a plain community tank
As for what i can find locally, there is nothing really round here as far as appisto's go so i was going to have to travel to get anything. Both the local fish shops won't stock them as they are too aggressive. I have travelled 100+ miles at least 10 times this year to see what is avalible. This make them expensive before we even have the tank set up.

Does anyone know of good cichild suppliers in the Staffordshire area? Also does any one know where supplies good glass only tanks?