• Hello guest! Are you an Apistogramma enthusiast? If so we invite you to join our community and see what it has to offer. Our site is specifically designed for you and it's a great place for Apisto enthusiasts to meet online. Once you join you'll be able to post messages, upload pictures of your fish and tanks and have a great time with other Apisto enthusiasts. Sign up today!

New Apistogramma keeper!

Kaanie

New Member
Messages
6
IMG_2834.jpeg
IMG_3082.jpeg
IMG_3071.jpeg
IMG_2780.jpeg
IMG_2584.jpeg
Hi I’m Kaan,

Have been aquascaping for a few years now and recently started with my first pair of Apistogramma Ortegai (wild caught)

I guess they are enjoying themselves in the scape and are raising the second spawn as I post.

The tank is an ILA 65x50x40 cm / 25x19x15 Inch approximately 148L / 39 Gallons

It’s a nice community tank with a school of Ruby tetras, green neon tetras (paracheirodon simulans) ottos and couple of red racer snails (Vittina waigiensis). I’m waiting to get the bottom crew that will be a small group of corydora habrosus or hastatus.

It has a biomaster 600 stocked packed with biohome ultimate (like 3KG) lid by a WRGB Pro 2 light and CO2 gas injection and dosing ATP and Excel they love the dr Bassleer dry food in the morning and frozen foods for dinner.

Had to struggle to get the tank balanced as it was the first time I used such a strong light but finally moving towards a nice healthy almost algae free tank!

*I cleaned the lily pipes and tubes yesterday *
 

Attachments

  • IMG_2740.jpeg
    IMG_2740.jpeg
    4.2 MB · Views: 96

MacZ

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,902
Location
Germany
Frank, the fish above lack the slightly lyre/trapezoid tail of A. sp. Nanay, having a rounded caudal instead.
But I would also not say A. (cf.) ortegai. Cruzi/Eunotus-Complex for sure, but neither A. sp. Nanay nor A. cf. ortegai.
I lack the experience to say what they are, but I definitely can tell what they are not.

The tank is not what I would call species-appropriate but as a biotope aquarist the whole "scaping, CO2, always clean, no algae"-thing just makes me cringe anyway. I find the tank especially overstocked.

I’m waiting to get the bottom crew that will be a small group of corydora habrosus or hastatus.
Leave it. The tank is too small for the combination of Apistogramma and Corydoras. Also the small species will be especially easy pickings for the Apistos.
Read about Catfish problems here:
 
Last edited:

Mike Wise

Moderator
Staff member
5 Year Member
Messages
11,173
Location
Denver, Colorado, U.S.A.
The 2nd photo shows a definite split in Bar 6, diagnostic for eunotus-subcomplex species. In addition, the female does not exhibit the "∞" double caudal patch diagnostic for A. ortegai. So it definitely is not A. ortegai. It appears to be one of the many forms/species of A. cf. eunotus, probably Orangeflossen/Orange-fin.
 

Mike Wise

Moderator
Staff member
5 Year Member
Messages
11,173
Location
Denver, Colorado, U.S.A.
The male's dorsal is much higher and more serrated than on cruzi-complex species unless very old, as in your photo - and I'm not even certain that this fish is the original Nanay form which had a lower and more even dorsal.:)
 

MacZ

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,902
Location
Germany
I'm not even certain that this fish is the original Nanay form which had a lower and more even dorsal.
Looking for comparison material besides Tom's site you will find quite a range of superficially similar but in detail highly diverging specimens on the net. To be honest... I'm kinda lost by now and have no idea which is the original now.
 

Frank Hättich

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Messages
553
Location
Germany
I'm not even certain that this fish is the original Nanay form which had a lower and more even dorsal.:)
Looking for comparison material besides Tom's site you will find quite a range of superficially similar but in detail highly diverging specimens on the net.
That's why I said "A. sp. Nanay (or better: the group of forms we label as such)" ;)
 

Kaanie

New Member
Messages
6
Frank, the fish above lack the slightly lyre/trapezoid tail of A. sp. Nanay, having a rounded caudal instead.
But I would also not say A. (cf.) ortegai. Cruzi/Eunotus-Complex for sure, but neither A. sp. Nanay nor A. cf. ortegai.
I lack the experience to say what they are, but I definitely can tell what they are not.

The tank is not what I would call species-appropriate but as a biotope aquarist the whole "scaping, CO2, always clean, no algae"-thing just makes me cringe anyway. I find the tank especially overstocked.


Leave it. The tank is too small for the combination of Apistogramma and Corydoras. Also the small species will be especially easy pickings for the Apistos.
Read about Catfish problems here:
Frank, the fish above lack the slightly lyre/trapezoid tail of A. sp. Nanay, having a rounded caudal instead.
But I would also not say A. (cf.) ortegai. Cruzi/Eunotus-Complex for sure, but neither A. sp. Nanay nor A. cf. ortegai.
I lack the experience to say what they are, but I definitely can tell what they are not.

The tank is not what I would call species-appropriate but as a biotope aquarist the whole "scaping, CO2, always clean, no algae"-thing just makes me cringe anyway. I find the tank especially overstocked.


Leave it. The tank is too small for the combination of Apistogramma and Corydoras. Also the small species will be especially easy pickings for the Apistos.
Read about Catfish problems here:
Well we all have our preferences and the best we can do is respect each one another’s likings. I’m not a fan of biotope purist because you’ll be surprised to what you will find in the wild. Unless you also ad your dose of plastic and construction leftovers in your Amazon biotipes. I don’t mind a bit of algae at all. Blue green algae on the other hand is a big no for me and the tank was over running. The tank has a lot of hiding places packed with plants and I even build caves for the Apistogramma I which they are happily spawning. The water quality is top notch thanks to the filtration and regular maintenance. I don’t remove any algae or biofilm from the plants or hardscape and there is zero aggression in the aquarium. Certainly the female protects the fry and the otos are warned when they get to close but if had the male sifting trough the soil with the oto on a leaf on top of him. The tetras are swimming with him to catch the food he floats up when he’s scavenging that looks so amazing like watching a shark with remora . I used aqadvisor to be sure I don’t overstock and trust me with the filtration I have I’m not near overstocking. I want the Cory’s because I really like the species and I’m pretty sure I can make it work. I even have neocaridina shrimp in there that serve as the occasional life food but they are able to survive in there. It all keeps them busy and happy. I’ll post a video as soon as I get the chance. All in all the apisto’s would not spawn if they didn’t feel comfortable and the environment didn’t meet there expectations so aquascape or biotope it all comes down how good you did to make the fish happy.
 

MacZ

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,902
Location
Germany
I’m not a fan of biotope purist because you’ll be surprised to what you will find in the wild. Unless you also ad your dose of plastic and construction leftovers in your Amazon biotipes.
I should actually stop anwering after that remark which simply completely misses the point of it all.
I used aqadvisor to be sure I don’t overstock and trust me with the filtration I have I’m not near overstocking.
Overstocking is not just bioload as that horrible site makes people think. Space requirements, preferred swimming patterns and areas, requirements for territory (yes, also for for tetras, they do have that) and appropriate structure also determine whether a tank is overstocked.

Otherwise... nevermind. I doubt it's worth trying. I mean that in the nicest way possible. Good luck.
 
Last edited:

Andrew H

Member
Messages
49
I should actually stop anwering after that remark which simply completely misses the point of it all.

Overstocking is not just bioload as that horrible site makes people think. Space requirements, preferred swimming patterns and areas, requirements for territory (yes, also for for tetras, they do have that) and appropriate structure also determine whether a tank is overstocked.

Otherwise... nevermind. I doubt it's worth trying. I mean that in the nicest way possible. Good luck.
I’d like to say the tank looks beautiful and clearly the well being of the livestock is a high priority. Great to provide advice and guidance but this isn’t a “how many GLO(TM)-Apistos can I put into my 7 gallon brackish goldfish tank” post. Anyways, not trying to stir the pot, and I’ve gotten tons of great advice on this forum (especially from Mac), but evangelism requires patience.
 

Kaanie

New Member
Messages
6
IMG_3769.jpeg


This is the best I could do, hope some of them are helpful. I actually came across the forum while looking up more information after they spawned. Knowing the exact species will definitely help in providing them an even better environment! I observed the tank for a long time and I think the Otocinclus would be most bothered by the Cory’s so the tank is good as it is! Well at-least stock wise definitely more plants!
 

Attachments

  • IMG_3562.jpeg
    IMG_3562.jpeg
    2.4 MB · Views: 85
  • IMG_3566.jpeg
    IMG_3566.jpeg
    2.6 MB · Views: 76
  • IMG_3577.jpeg
    IMG_3577.jpeg
    2.9 MB · Views: 80
  • IMG_3673.jpeg
    IMG_3673.jpeg
    3 MB · Views: 84
  • IMG_3684.jpeg
    IMG_3684.jpeg
    2.7 MB · Views: 79
  • IMG_3687.jpeg
    IMG_3687.jpeg
    2.5 MB · Views: 81
  • IMG_3706.jpeg
    IMG_3706.jpeg
    2.5 MB · Views: 80
  • IMG_3709.jpeg
    IMG_3709.jpeg
    2.5 MB · Views: 81
  • IMG_3713.jpeg
    IMG_3713.jpeg
    2.7 MB · Views: 89
  • IMG_3712.jpeg
    IMG_3712.jpeg
    2.7 MB · Views: 75
  • IMG_3715.jpeg
    IMG_3715.jpeg
    3.6 MB · Views: 86
  • IMG_3744.jpeg
    IMG_3744.jpeg
    3.7 MB · Views: 77
  • IMG_3561.jpeg
    IMG_3561.jpeg
    2.4 MB · Views: 95

Kaanie

New Member
Messages
6
I’d like to say the tank looks beautiful and clearly the well being of the livestock is a high priority. Great to provide advice and guidance but this isn’t a “how many GLO(TM)-Apistos can I put into my 7 gallon brackish goldfish tank” post. Anyways, not trying to stir the pot, and I’ve gotten tons of great advice on this forum (especially from Mac), but evangelism requires patience.
Thanks Andrew, much appreciated. The response from Mac felt a bit harsh and unwelcome and I understand the forum would be more focused on true biotopes but like a mentioned I love to create a different type of under water art. Really did my best to get the best of both worlds. I run the lights as low as possible and moved it all the way to the back so it’s focused on the stems. Planted low light slow growers at the front so they would feel comfortable and have tons of places to retract to if they get spooked or stressed in any way. As soon as the Pinnatifida starts to grow they’ll even have more shade and cover.
 

Members online

No members online now.

Forum statistics

Threads
17,879
Messages
115,905
Members
12,997
Latest member
TheGjboz

Latest profile posts

EDO
Longtime fish enthusiast for over 70years......keen on Apistos now. How do I post videos?
Looking for some help with fighting electric blue rams :(
Partial updated Peruvian list have more than this. Please PM FOR ANY QUESTIONS so hard to post with all the ads poping up every 2 seconds….
我的英语很差,请原谅我!
Top