My A. agassizii

[beleg]

Hello,
This is my pair of A.agassizii in a 60lt tank. I keep them at 26-27C with a single neon and otto. Currently pH is 7.3 trying to drop it with peat and very diluted HCl. They have bred 2 times (first at pH 7.9 , second at 7.4) in the back of the driftwood where i didn't want them to breed at all. I don't know if the male can fit in there and do his job properly. Both attempts failed. I'll keep trying to reduce the pH below 7 and remove that driftwood to force her to choose the coconut shell or the Terracotta cup.

I would like to know your comments about the male.. He looks shorter than he should be.. Does his form have a problem you think? Can the stockiness be a sign of sterile?

Male

Female

The Pair

 

[Mike Wise]

The male does look a bit obese, but with heavily line-bred fish body shape can change. It seems that your fish was selectively bred for fin color, not body shape.

 

[beleg]

I feed them 2-3 times a day with a 2-3 tetra discus bits per fish and 4-5 frozen artemia adults per fish.

Can the male be sterile because he looks chubby to me too. I chose this male over the other one because of his colors too.

 

[Mike Wise]

I personally think that you might be over-feeding your fish. It might be possible that excess fat affects sterility, but I think providing soft acid water will lead to sucess.

 

[beleg]

Well the fish was like this when i purchased but i will reduce the amount i feed him. My water is naturally alkaline (7.4). I have been dosing diluted HCl to keep it low (7.0 or less). Does that have a side effect on fish in the long term?

 

[Mike Wise]

I have used HCl in the past to drop the pH. I definitely would not use it in a tank with live fish. Mix it with water in a separate container. Once you are certain that the pH will not 'bounce' back into the alkaline range, use it for water changes. I find that it does increase the electrical conductivity, but A. agassizii is more tolerant of this than blackwater species.

 

[beleg]

Hi Mike. Thanks for the tip. I use it with a very diluted form not direct dropping of HCl into tank. I use 2-3 drops of 0.1mol HCl into 250 ml of tap water and add some drops from this to the tank.

Since i use pH6.5 water for water changes , best solution for me is to get a KH kit asap. I don't understand why pH keeps jumping back.

 

[Mike Wise]

It probably is your alkalinity (KH). You can keep adding HCl until it permanently removes any CO3 & HCO3, but it will probably raise the conductivity considerably. I was using concentrated HCl - 5 ml/40 litres to drop my water from pH 7.5 to 3.5! Obviously very low KH in my water (<2º dKH)!

 

[beleg]

I wouldn't dare using concentrated HCl i have a kid at home Hopefully tomorrow morning i will get my KH kit to test my KH. When i reset up my tank i used more than half of the water from old setup (the one with pH8) not to disturb the fish. Perhaps the very high KH is still from there. Anyway we will see tomorrow night.

Thanks for your inputs. I will keep this thread updated with my progrss.. Hopefully with good results

 

[gan]

but it will probably raise the conductivity considerably.

Mike - what wrong is in higher conductivity? This conductivity originate from ions H+ (and Cl-) and (I suppose) is harmless for fishes. When pH is droping from 8 to 6 concentration of ions H+ is rising 100 times.
The conductivity originating form "mineral" ions: Na+, K+, Ca++, Mg++ is harmful for fishes.

I suppose: key value is osmotic pressure, but we can not measure it directly. In the past we measured GH and KH to describe different kinds of water, but for "rainforest" waters (and fishes) this is not adequate. Now we can measure the conductivity - this is better parameter, but not perfect in this case.

GAN
[I hope you can understand me despite my English ;-) ]

 

[Mike Wise]

There are several reports that high conductivity adversely affects the successful spawning of blackwater species who are not sujected to such conditions in the wild. All I know is that my conductivity increases when I use HCl in my water - the same is true for my water treated with peat.

 

[gan]

Generally you are right: higher conductivity has negative influence on spawning of blackwater species, but we should be aware of fact where this higher conductivity comes from. When conductivity is a result of "mineral" ions concentration, it may affect the successful spawning, but when it is a result of raising hydrogen-ion concentration - IMHO there are not negative effects.

Did you notice problems with spawning after using HCl or peat and raising of the conductivity? From my experience visible is only favourable effect of pH droping.

GAN

 

[beleg]

An update.

After the test my aquariums KH is 2. pH still lingers between 7.10 in the morning and 7.4 at night which is normal for a planted tank.

The abnormal thing is despite the low KH the pH keeps coming back to 7.10 when i add HCl. Can a phosphate tampon be causing this? In this soft water can aggies breed even the pH is swinging between 7.1-7.4?

 

[Mike Wise]

If you cannot lower the pH below 7 - with 2º dKH - you must have something in the aquarium that is buffering the water. Normal biological activity under these conditions should lower the pH below 7 - without any additives. Since your fish are domestic fish of a species that is very adaptable to water values, I imaging that they will eventually breed successfully. The spawns might not be as large as in soft, slightly acid water, however.

 

[beleg]

Update:

Sunday i changed %50 of the tanks water with pH6.5 and KH 2. This morning tanks pH was 6.9 (from 7.1) during the course of the day i expect it to go up to 7.1 due to photosynthesis. If the pH stabilizes at 6.9 i will keep water changes until whatever is buffering the water is removed.

For my next water change should i go for one %30 or 2 X %15 this week? The female seems to be ready to spawn again.

 

[beleg]

Another batch of eggs are laid. She seems to be more excited this time. Chases the male around sometimes.

pH of the tank goes up to 7.3 after 24 hour of light .. Is there another way to protect eggs from predation (by mom,dad or snails?) other than keeping lights on for 24 hrs? Can a smaller light in which the plants will not photosynthesis be enough?

 

[Mike Wise]

I suggest that you remove the male & any other fish. You can use a 7 - 15W child's "night light" over the tank at night without causing problems. I find that female A. agassizii who have problems keeping eggs/fry do well if there are no other fish in the aquarium.

 

[beleg]

I suggest that you remove the male & any other fish. You can use a 7 - 15W child's "night light" over the tank at night without causing problems. I find that female A. agassizii who have problems keeping eggs/fry do well if there are no other fish in the aquarium.

Ok i'll try this next

 

[beleg]

I managed to reduce the pH to a stable 6.7-6.9 range with KH2 with peat filtering. On the next breeding i will remove the neon and put the male inside a fry rearing net (a quite big one).

The female is feeling much more secure now. The male never chases her and she chases him sometimes.

I had used omnipur from Sera to cure the male in a 2 lt cup with daily water changes (%100). He healed in 2 days. But i wonder if that might have caused sterility?

I have another male that i can try. If this time she eats the babies too I'll switch the males.

Any suggestions?

 

[volkant80]

hi

Hi, my dear friend. How are you?
I want see your other male photo.