Limits for bringing fish into the U.S.?

[Nebraska_cichlids]

I have a business trip overseas coming up and was planning to bring back five fish to the U.S. I have done this before and already made an appointment with the wildlife inspectors ar O'Hare. Now, on a short notice, I have the opportunity to bring back another five fish of a different species. It is my understanding that the limit is 5 fish per hobbyist (without importer's license). Is the limit "5 fish per species" of "5 fish total"? Thanks.

 

[Mike Wise]

I can't really say. It probably depends on the inspector. For example, I brought ~150 wild fish from Peru in my luggage. I even listed them on my customs form as "~150 small fish for personal aquariums". The customs official looked at the form and said, "Fish, eh? Fish are OK". He then let me through. He didn't even check my bags! I can't say the same will happen to you.

 

[tjudy]

In Chicago... and I am very confident in saying this because I have been communicating and debating the nuances of the rule with the head inspector there since I arrived home from Gabon... the rule says that a person may bring in 7 fish without an import permit. In Chicago they do NOT interpret that as 7 fish of one species. 7 fish... period. I suspect that if you did NOT make an appointment with USFWS and brought in 10 - 12 you would be OK.

 

[Nebraska_cichlids]

My (limited) experience with O'Hare is that the inspectors are courteous, but really want to follow the rules. The first time I brought fish into the U.S. I didn't even know that I was expected to make an appointment, but declared the fish on my customs form. No wildlife inspector was to be found and finally one of the security guys handled my case (and issued a warning without telling me). He let me take the fish. Next time, I made an appointment, but brought about 15 fish (one species). The wildlife inspector let me bring in the fish, not without adding another warning to my file (and telling me that I already had one). The third time I got it right - appointment and only five fish.

This time I will test the seven-fish-limit mentioned by Ted.

Last question: After making your appointment ahead of time, do you call the wildlife people 24 to 48 hours before you enter the country just as they suggest you do? I find that requirement somewhat inconvient, especially when traveling abroad.

 

[tjudy]

What I do is make the appointment a day or two before I leave the USA, give them my flight information and get the name on the agent who made the appointment. When we got back from Gabon they did not show up for the appointment, but I had all that information so the USFWS person on site did the inspection (apparently not all the agents are supposed to do it).

From what I have been told, the Chicago ladies (and they are are ladies in the inspection team), make things a lot more difficult than the inspectors in Miami, L.A., Houston, Denver, or New York.

 

[Nebraska_cichlids]

Good idea. I will call them again the day before leaving the U.S. Last time the USFWS guy faxed me a confiormation, this time his colleague didn't want to do that. The last two times I was inspected by one of the USFWS women on staff at O'Hare. A really pleasant person, actually. Or is it my charme that made her smile?

 

[tjudy]

They are pleasant, but they are also very strict and have a different interpretation of the rules. I was initially not charged for the inspection because I did not intend to sell the fish. The new inspector on site (the girl who had to do the inspection because the other lady forgot to show up) waived the fee because I was not 'commercial'. I got a call a week later asking to pay the fee. We debated the meaning of 'commercial'. According to the lady in charge, if I am going to make money off of the fish in ANY WAY, then I am commercial. That includes breeding and selling the fry, writing an article for TFH or selling a picture. In my opinion... its crap. The rules were set up to tax importers bringing in fish for resale. The rules used to be based on dollar amount on the invoice, so a collector would not need an import permit because the dollar value they claimed was less than $10K/year. That is the truth, so long as you are not buying or selling the fish. A few STUPID individual importers abused the system a few years ago by importing many thousands of dollars worth of fish and having the exporter write an invoice saying that the fish were worth basically nothing, and the importers use a lot of different people to each bring in $8K worth of fish each year... under the limit. Those idiots ruined the deal for legitimate hobbyist importers, because the USFWS had to go to a number if fish based system rather than a dollar value. But the anti-pet lobbyists got a word in, and the number was made so low that it is basically not worthwhile to bring fish in at all unless you buy a $100 permit and pay a $165 inspection fee.

 

[Mike Wise]

Interesting, Ted. My flight arrived at 2:30 a.m. at LAX. I wonder if that had anything to do with how easy I got off.

 

[apistodave]

Inspectors

I had a horrible experience in Chicago. I ran into an officious, badge heavy little prick in Portland, every where else has been fine--Boston was the best-the young lady was nice, pleasant to look at and bought me a cup of coffee after I showed her the "book".....

The Fish and wildlife people are the most dis-organised bunch of amateurs on the planet--the idiot in Chicago couldnt read Engliish and allowed me to pressure her-she took my credit card number and waved me through after about an hour of trying to look up the rules for my situation. I was going to miss my flight cause of her and started jamming her and she got my CC number and said she would charge the inspection. After about a week of being home, the idiots in Portland called me and said things didnt work like that--that I was supposed to come through there. They wanted me to get the fish and come up and have them inspected. I told them I didnt work like that and for them to send an inspector down to my place. I never heard back. San Francisco from now on--nothing but greenies down there--one of the key things to do is to come in to a Port of Entry without a lot of traffic and a slim history of smuggling.

They also look closely at where you are coming from--Mike I bet if you had come from Asia they would have looked closer

 

[Mike Wise]

David, I too had a book (copy of the DATZ book with my ugly mug in it) to show that I was an "expert" & knew what I was doing. I didn't have to use it. Maybe it was my friendly, helpful outlook (God smiles on the simple people) and the fact that I'd lived in the jungle for a month (more baths??) that got me through.

 

[apistodave]

Well I am going back to Germany after Uwe gets back from Peru in August--to check on preps for bringing the new book out and to pick up some new sp. I am going to go with the handsome, smelly, book picture strategy and go through SF. Since there are no longer non stops from Portland to FR I think I will be OK

Last we talked he had some elizabathae and Diplotania for me

 

[Nebraska_cichlids]

Okay, I've made it back into the U.S. with the fish. (I was handed only six specimens in Germany, but all of them made it safely into the U.S.) The experience at O'Hare was different thyan before. Although I hade made my reservation with the wildlife inspectors and arrived mid afternoon, they didn't show. They had notified a customs officer, though, and he was handling my case. Everything went very smoothly. He didn't even open the box, but collected copies of my passport and the veterinarian's certificate. I knew they'd like these copies and brought them along. (If anyone wants to try: I don't think you need a vet's certificate, but some sort of semi-professional paperwork to document that the fish are healthy and were bred in captivity always helps in my limited experience.)