Dead Gold Ram

[Jshafer81]

Hello,

I came home tonight to find my Gold Ram dead in my 29 gallon tank. The fish had shown no indication of being unhealthy. Water conditions had been constant since I bought the fish about half a year ago....
ph= 6.5, Nitrates, Ammonia= 0, temp= 80 degrees..

It's tankmates included a pair of Apisto caucatoides, two angels, a dwarf gourami, a small pleco, small farlowella and three tetras. When I first introudced the A. cacautoides the male and the ram sparred for about two weeks, but things eventually calmed down.

The ram was floating in the water column and it looked as if it's side had been torn out. I say this because what appeared to be a large mass of tissue was hanging out and it appeared as if it had bled on that side. This may also have been a fungus. I'm not very familiar with diseases, having just gotten back into the hobby in the last year.

Anyways, just trying to get any ideas on what may have happened and on any other conidtions I may need to check to insure the safey of my other fish.

thanks,
Justin

 

[fishgeek]

very hard to tell from your description sorry
to me fungal wounds would look very different to traumatic

At worst for yu the description could be construed as open tuberculosis which is communicable to people
I do not know how common this is in dwarves nor aquariums in large , it is as i said just a worst case scenario

Ideally ensure you have no broken skin when working in your tank and wash arms/hands well after

otherwise maybe more regular water changes in the short term to help reduce any possible free living pathogens in the tank and produce the best enviroment for your other surviving fish

sorry the response is so vague, it is just hard for me to imagine any specific's from your description, is uppose it is to late for a photo
Andrew

 

[2la]

A minor quibble with the loose language here (you're certainly not the first to do this, Andrew, so I'm not picking on you), but fish don't get tuberculosis--caused by Mycobacterium tuberculosis--nor, therefore, can you catch tuberculosis (a primarily pulmonary disease that can affect multiple systems in its disseminated form) from working in a fish tank. What you can catch is a granulomatous disease primarily of the skin often called "fish tank granuloma" that in about a third of cases can spread to involve the bones and/or joints and is caused by the bacterium M. marinum.

 

[farm41]

I think the tetras I had 4 years ago had that, they made it to the Lab of Dr. Micheal Kent at OSU. I believe that he identified the disease as Mycobacterium Tuberculosis, or fish TB. I think I still have the emails and the article he sent me at work.

 

[farm41]

http://oregonstate.edu/dept/salmon/projects/zebrafish.html

I haven't found the specific article yet, but working on it

 

[farm41]

More info

http://www.neuro.uoregon.edu/ionmain/Fish_Diseases.html

 

[2la]

Several species in the genus Mycobacterium have been associated with disease in fishes, including M. marinum, M. abscessus (= M. chelonae subsp. abscessus), and M. fortuitum.

No mention of M. tuberculosis or of the M. tuberculosis complex. The above fall within the category of non-tuberculoid mycobacteria, NMT, or mycobacteria other than tuberculosis (MOTT). The term "fish tuberculosis" is another example of loose terminology. Again, it's a minor quibble--I mention it only to defuse any fears of actually catching primary tuberculous lung disease from working in a fish tank--it's mainly a skin/wound infection. This isn't an entirely trivial matter, though: An inadequately informed person might both avoid you and suggest to you that you be hospitalized under isolation if you told them, "I caught tuberculosis from my aquarium." That would be true if you actually caught tried and true tuberculosis, but you didn't. I tried finding references to M. tuberculosis being isolated from fish but thus far have been unsuccessful...

 

[fishgeek]

Thanks for the clarification and information guy's , much appreciated

Andrew

 

[farm41]

The article and emails from Dr. Kent are gone, too bad. I think 2la has it pegged though.

 

[2la]

Thanks for the effort, Matt. If you do find any references of M. tuberculosis being found in fish, please let me know--it's as much professional curiosity as it is personal!

 

[dfishtales]

The one thing i am thinking is it was being chased hit the glass knocked it out and or it ate something and it lodged in him, and when he died he was then canibilized by it's tank mates, in the fish feeding frenzy "fresh Meat" terminology. just a thought? later, Dfishtales.