Apistoguy52
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Interesting. Thank you!The photos I have seen of these on Facebook made me doubt that it is a form of A. cf. taeniata/resticulosa. The abdominal markings didn't fit to those known from resticulosa-complex species at all (instead of poorly defined streaks/dashes they showed rows of well defined streaks or spots sometimes even connected to form continous abdominal stripes). Moreover they showed a very pale zone between lateral band and caudal spot and the latter extended almost over the complete height of the caudal peduncle. My guess would be that it's more likely a regani-complex species with similarities to A. geisleri.
There are more amazing instances of very similar species/forms found far apart from each other or even in different river-systems. If you are interested in this, I recommend this excellent article: PALEOGEOGRAPHY OF SOUTH AMERICA AND ITS EFFECTS ON THE DISTRIBUTION & PHYLOGENY OF APISTOGRAMMA-SPECIES-GROUPS by Mike Wise.Quite amazing! Abidos is quite some distance from Careiro, near Manuas (200 miles?), and on the opposite side of the river.
So if I am reading that correctly, a Regani Complex species, from the Southern bank of the Amazon would be quite the outlier? Reticulosa Complex +/- southern bank, Regani Complex +/- northern bank ? Bucket biologists stocking fish for easier collection later?There are more amazing instances of very similar species/forms found far apart from each other or even in different river-systems. If you are interested in this, I recommend this excellent article: PALEOGEOGRAPHY OF SOUTH AMERICA AND ITS EFFECTS ON THE DISTRIBUTION & PHYLOGENY OF APISTOGRAMMA-SPECIES-GROUPS by Mike Wise.
Yes, but there are some from southern tributaries of the Amazon too. You can find more detailed information about the distribution of the regani-complex species (and in fact all other species-groups/complexes) here: Apistogramma Species List By Species-Groups/ComplexesSo if I am reading that correctly, a Regani Complex species, from the Southern bank of the Amazon would be quite the outlier?
Yes, unfortunately some fishermen/exporters resettle fish closer to their home/business to have easier access to them.Bucket biologists stocking fish for easier collection later?
As I continue to try and research this, I am still somewhat confused. The abdominal stripes, and the pale zone between the lateral band, and caudal spot, land these fish in the regani complex in your opinion. That seems like a fair position, I understand that. I seem to be lost making the connections that would confer these fish with A. geisleri.The photos I have seen of these on Facebook made me doubt that it is a form of A. cf. taeniata/resticulosa. The abdominal markings didn't fit to those known from resticulosa-complex species at all (instead of poorly defined streaks/dashes they showed rows of well defined streaks or spots sometimes even connected to form continous abdominal stripes). Moreover they showed a very pale zone between lateral band and caudal spot and the latter extended almost over the complete height of the caudal peduncle. My guess would be that it's more likely a regani-complex species with similarities to A. geisleri.
Don't worry, it's pretty normal that the more you study this genus the more confusion arisesAs I continue to try and research this, I am still somewhat confused.
The abdominal stripes are not a diagnostic feature of the regani-complex, such stripes occur in many species-groups/complexes. Regarding the abdominal stripes my main point was that they don’t fit to the resticulosa-complex. What makes me think these fish are a regani-complex species is the pale zone in front of the caudal spot and the latter’s vertical extension.The abdominal stripes, and the pale zone between the lateral band, and caudal spot, land these fish in the regani complex in your opinion. That seems like a fair position, I understand that.
Which of the orbital stripes does this statement refer to, pre- post-, sub- or supraorbital stripe? Anyway, according to my experience none of them is always present in any Apisto. These markings are highly dependent on the mood of the fish! In fact terms like “always” or “never” are almost always wrong when used to describe the phenotypic features of Apistos.The orbital stripe, which if I read correctly, should always be present in geisleri, is present maybe 50% of the time with these fish.
My most trusted source of information about A. geisleri (Koslowski: “Die Buntbarsche Amerikas”, Vol. 2) doesn’t mention the rare presence of the lateral band at all nor do the photos I know of this species point towards this.The lateral band, which again, if I read correctly, is rarely present on geisleri, is present most of the time with these.
Caudal pattern can be very variable too in two respects: they often vary among different specimens of the same species (in some species from being present to being completely absent) as well as in different stages of life of the same specimen (usually there are less and/or less pronounced ones at younger age).Caudal pattern of 5 bands, present on the center of the caudal (geisleri), vs 6/7 present on almost the entire caudal with these.
If you mean the abdominal stripes (referred to earlier), they are usually shown while being aggressive or displaying.I've also seen it eluded to that geisleri displays no abdominal bands?
What makes the identification of Apistos so difficult, is on the one hand the variabilty of most of their phenotypic features within a given species and on the other hand the weighting of all the features against each other.Am I just failing to see the forest through the trees so to speak? I am not sure how certain traits are weighed against others in things of these matters.
Amazing! We have the same fish! Very nice photos BTWI wanted to show you what I bought as A[istogramma cf. Taeniata but which was actually renamed as Apistogramma cf. Geisleri (Careiro) when I spoke with Frank, he explained several details that the fish showed that it was closer to being identified as Apistogramma cf. Geisleri (Careiro) , it was a good analysis and here I leave the photos of the fish I bought.
Greetings
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