A. cf pertensis & A. gibbiceps Info Needed

[slimbolen99]

I'm going to be receiving four wild A. cf pertensis and a spawning pair of A. gibbiceps from Steve Thornton (aka Freshwaterfishfan) next Saturday. Can anyone give me a quick run down on the setup they would require?

I currently have Apistogramma agassizi "double red", Apistogramma eunotus (Orangeschwanz), Apistogramma iniridae, and Apistogramma schwarzkinn/black-chin, all of which except for the iniridae are spawning.

I'm thinking low pH, soft water, mid to high 70s? Leaf litter covered substrate of sand?

Also would like some background on them. I can't find a whole lot of info on them online.

Thanks!
Brian

 

[Mike Wise]

Both should breed in water conditions similar to that needed by A. iniridae: pH <6; hardness <5º dGH, <2º dKH. Less extreme values sometimes work. It depends on the population. Most of the recent apisto books discuss the two species. I suggest you buy one. It's well worth the money.

 

[slimbolen99]

Thanks Mike. I'll browse around other posts and see if there are some suggestions on books.

 

[Apistomaster]

I have had both of these and agree with Mike except I suggest even lower values and higher temperatures.
I used a TDS/EC meter so my target would be less than 30 ppm, pH 4.0 to 5.0 and 80*F to 84*F. They are mostly from the Rio Negro drainage to my knowledge which is characterized as being black, clear water, pH of as low as 3.5 to 4.0 and typically pretty warm water. They share their range with Heckel Discus which are often found in water at 86*F.

 

[slimbolen99]

Well, the new arrivals have arrived. Also picked up a wild trio of A. panduro from Wetspot. Up to 7 species now. Pretty sure this is "it" for a while.

Apistogramma agassizi "double red"
Apistogramma cf. pertensis
Apistogramma eunotus "orangeschwanz"
Apistogramma gibbiceps
Apistogramma iniridae
Apistogramma panduro
Apistogramma schwarzkinn "black-chin"

 

[Crazygar]

Just keep an eye on the biofilter, a pH under 5 can cause it to crash! It can be done, though, just keep things pure.

Gary

 

[Apistomaster]

I think the reason why some experience a failure of their biological filtration is due to making the changes too fast.
I think there are nitrifying bacteria species which are adapted to different conditions which become ascendant as the conditions begin to favor them.
Nothing else would explain why I have no trouble keeping Heckel Discus in water with a pH of 3.5 to 4.o and a TDS >20 ppm.
I have another tank set up with the same water chemistry for a year now where I keep my Black Darter Tetras(Poeciliocharaax weitzmani) and Parotocinclus cf. epplyei. The Singapore Moss in this tank is growing wall to wall in a luxuriant carpet.

It is only when you make drastic chemistry changes faster than the appropriate bacteria can keep up with that you will have the bio-filter 'crash".
It is possible that at the very lowest end of the fish keeping ranges of ph that these surviving bacteria are less efficient when it comes to coping with any excess ammonium and nitrites but these are always species of fish which should be kept in only the cleanest water and never over crowded in the first place. These factors are under our control.

 

[Crazygar]

I always gun for 5.5 as a bare minimum for pH. At this level, you can achieve most breeding for our favourite Blackwater fish.

I've had a few crashes, but I believe at least 2 were totally my fault (tinkering) but the others well, they just happened...

Gary