A.- bientanal

[sasikan]

these were sold to me as a male and female .what do you think? sorry about the heading its should read A.bitaeniata

 

[grumpy55]

Sorry for hijack, don't know how to start a new thread.
Mike Wise, Apistodave ... are there any "new" Apistogramma books available ?
I have Tetra "Dwarf Chiclids", sounds like reading a "book style" encyclopedia !
Thank-you.

 

[Mike Wise]

Sasikan,

I've never heard of "A. bientanal". It could be a corrupted spelling of either A. bitaeniata or A. borellii (Pantanal). Since there are no photos, it's hard to say what you have.

Grumpy,

The Tetra book by Linke & Staeck - at least the English edition - is quite old. It is the 1985 (I believe) edition originally published in German. There have been several revised editions (in German) since then. Since then there have been several books on apisto published by Koslowski (2 books), Staeck, and Mayland & Bork. The latest are the 2005 DATZ special publication South American Dwarf Cichlids (DATZ book), which is mostly a picture reference, and 2006 Cichlid Atlas 2, which is an addendum volume to the more comprehensive Cichlid Atlas 1. CA2 doesn't discuss most of the apistos; that is left to CA1. These are the last books on apistos published that I know about.

 

[sasikan]

you cant see the picture?

 

[Amazoniensis]

yes we can't see it

 

[aquaticclarity]

I can see it now!

Two males...no question at all. Females don't have the fin extentions in the dorsal (top fin) let along a number of other noticable features.

 

[sasikan]

that's what i tough also (bought these over the internet) but the seller assured me these were a m&f they were smaller when i got them but they still looked like 2 males to me. buyer beware i guess. anybody have A. bitaeniata females for sale?

 

[Melanochromis]

It's hard to believe that the seller with a bit of Apistogramma knowledge would honestly not know these were both male (but they are very pretty nevertheless). There was one time I ordered a very expensive A. rositae pair from a very well-known Apistogramma dealer in Hong Kong. From the very moment I saw the fish I knew they were both male. And it took me months to get a real female, ironically from the same dealer but through a different middle person. So, this can be upsetting (but I hope you're not that upset because bitaeniata females should be easier to acquire than rositae)

Hope you'll get a female soon.

 

[grumpy55]

Thank-you, Mike

 

[Mike Wise]

If these A. bitaeniata were immature/small when sold, I guess it is possible that one of the males did not show male features at the time. This is one reason I never buy only 1 pair if I cannot see the fish in person.

 

[sasikan]

yes they were younger but old enough to doubt that i had 2 males (i told this to the seller but he assured me they were a m&f ) but you are right about buying just 2, i am still learning thanks

 

[wethumbs]

Skewed sex ratio is common in Apistos. Most breeders dont care or dont know how to control the sex ratio of the fry and just try to unload them whichever way they can. Calling two males pair or 3 males a trio. You best bet is to pick out a group in person, otherwise you are at the mercy of those who try to sell you all males. I have seen the same problem with westies, seeing fellow club members picked up a "Brokeback" pair and asking me how to breed them. I could see the disappointment in their faces when I told them they were both males. Since Apistos as well as westies are sexual dimorphic, they can be sexable as early as 7 to 8 weeks old depending on species.

A good question to ask breeders before buying from them is 'what sex ratio do they get from the spawn'. If they say 50/50. WALK AWAY! They are LYING! If they dont know since this is the 1st and 2nd spawn, ask them the water parameters they raise the fry at. If the answer is still dont know. WALK AWAY! As Romer pointed out in his book, sex ratio is strongly influenced by external environmental factors.

 

[animalmgc]

actually I was the seller and thats how I bought them u can contact Scott Arney@http://www.amazontropicalfishllc.com/stock.html
for buying some females .He always seems to have a stock of these thats who I bought them from as wilds.Its better to call him since he rarely answers e mails

 

[sasikan]

great, thanks for the info , i might have found some with aquaticclarity but its good to have a back-up plan ha. ps the apisto baenschi that you sold me have had babys yeah!!!

 

[animalmgc]

cool glad to hear

 

[RustedKnight]

Not sure how important this is, but it looks to me to be;

Apistogramma (cf) Bitaeniata - Rio Tigre

Absolutely stunning fish, get hold of a female from the original stockist if possible.

 

[Mike Wise]

... it looks to me to be;

Apistogramma (cf) Bitaeniata - Rio Tigre

No, they don't. These have more blue spangling on the face and are less colorful. They look somewhat (but not exactly) like the Shishita population to me. Funny thing, TomC & I found the Curutu morph in the Río Shishita, but not the Shishita morph. I would never list any fish with a morph/population/location name unless I knew it orginated there. Look for any commercial bitaeniata females to breed with your males - and call them "A. bitaeniata".

 

[RustedKnight]

No, they don't. These have more blue spangling on the face and are less colorful. They look somewhat (but not exactly) like the Shishita population to me. Funny thing, TomC & I found the Curutu morph in the Río Shishita, but not the Shishita morph. I would never list any fish with a morph/population/location name unless I knew it orginated there. Look for any commercial bitaeniata females to breed with your males - and call them "A. bitaeniata".

Haha, I stand thoroughly corrected xD