40 gallon project planning

[BSMet94]

My daughter and I have decided to put together a 40-gallon tank this summer and we intend to include at least a few Apistogramma residents. Why 40-gallon? Because our elderly red eared slider has moved on to the afterlife, and we still have his tank. Last weekend, we got out the cleaning vinegar and it cleaned it up really nice. Here's what we are planning, and would appreciated if anyone might point out any fatal flaws:

Tank: 40-gallon "breeder"
Substrate: planning on a mixture of dark brown gravel and decomposed granite from Home Depot, and we'll wash it really well
Filtration: a couple of good size sponge filters, air driven
Plant life: well planted with Amazon swords, valisineria, crypts, and some moss
Other hardscape: river rocks, manzanita branches, magnolia leaves, jacarana pods, etc. (all locally collected), plus some broken flower pots, or coconut shells, etc.
Water: our Southern California (hard) water, highly diluted with RO water to get the hardness down to about 5-10 degrees KH (with pH still probably about 7ish, but assuming the tannins from wood etc. will bring that down a bit)
Lighting: LED (looking at a 36-inch Finnex light, which is really attractive price-wise)
We'll set that up, and let the plants get grow a bit and water stabilized before adding the fish (in no apparent order, and not all at the same time):
- Small school (3-5) of Otocinclus
- School (8-10) of Silver Tip Tetras
- Small school (4-6) Pencilfish of some type (trifasciatus or beckfordi)
- Pair or trio of Apistogramma borellii
- Pair of Bolivian Rams

Our cichlid options might also be to have two sets of Borrellis instead of Borrellis on one side and Rams on the other. We've decided on Borrellis, mainly from reading this forum and the numerous recommendations about them being a good "starter" Apistogramma. The idea of Rams is simply because my daughter really likes them (and that counts). In both cases, we will probably obtain the cichlids online. Southern California isn't the best for Apistogrammas. LFS in my area have Mbunas as far as the eye can see, and the only LFS I know with Apistos (which is a really good LFS) limits us to asian-farmed Cacatuoides (in a couple color varieties) and once in a while Macmasteri as well.

We found a reasonable price source of good RO water from our LFS for now. The plan is to start with the tap water diluted with RO to a low but reasonable hardness, and then to make up evaporation with RO, and water change with diluted tap water. Later, we may invest in a 4-stage RO system (only about $120 for a 75 gpd set up).

Any thoughts or suggestions? This weekend is substrate washing, a bit of hardscaping, and filling/tuning the dilution, and start the planting.

Eric

 

[Epos7]

You might find some good info in a thread I started a few months back, since our tanks are almost identical dimensions: https://www.apistogramma.com/forum/threads/44-gallon-stocking.24859/

I'm still in the planning stages, but I can summarize some of my findings so far:

- I think the general consensus is to avoid keeping pairs (M/F) or trios (M/F/F) in a community aquarium as it almost always becomes too stressful for all the fish involved. Better to stick with just males for communities.
- 3 male Borelli would likely do well
- a single male of another species would do well
- 3 males of different Apisto species might work, but only if care is taken to ensure lots of line-of-sight blocks
- I also wanted to keep Bolivian Rams with Apistos but was advised against it
- Best to add all Apistos at the same time, otherwise one may view the whole tank as its territory and harass the newcomers

 

[BSMet94]

You might find some good info in a thread I started a few months back, since our tanks are almost identical dimensions: https://www.apistogramma.com/forum/threads/44-gallon-stocking.24859/

I'm still in the planning stages, but I can summarize some of my findings so far:

- I think the general consensus is to avoid keeping pairs (M/F) or trios (M/F/F) in a community aquarium as it almost always becomes too stressful for all the fish involved. Better to stick with just males for communities.
- 3 male Borelli would likely do well
- a single male of another species would do well
- 3 males of different Apisto species might work, but only if care is taken to ensure lots of line-of-sight blocks
- I also wanted to keep Bolivian Rams with Apistos but was advised against it

I just read through that thread. Thank you! Lots of good info there.

I'm now prepared to be told to stick with a single male or maybe three, and to stick with either the Apisto or the Rams and call it good. The 40-gal breeder has a decent footprint, so you'd think it could be set up to accomodate two territories if chock full of plants, leaf litter, etc. I'll take the expert's advice on that. I'd like to include the Rams, and I'm certain I've read accounts (maybe even in this forum) of Rams and Apistos being kept together, but there's no point in trying to hit a home run on my first at bat with Apistos.

I'm only finding Borellis online, available either as MFF trios or unsexed individuals. At $18 to $20/head, I guess in either case it might be best to keep another tank on stand-by in case one of them needs to take a "time out." I currently have a 15-gal tank that's unoccupied thanks to our goldfish getting an upgrade in his living quarters.

Eric

 

[Epos7]

I'm only finding Borellis online, available either as MFF trios or unsexed individuals. At $18 to $20/head, I guess in either case it might be best to keep another tank on stand-by in case one of them needs to take a "time out." I currently have a 15-gal tank that's unoccupied thanks to our goldfish getting an upgrade in his living quarters.

Eric

I've had trouble finding male Borellis myself. Seems like males of other types are more readily available. Borellis are mostly available unsexed or in pairs/trios. I'm lucky in that my LFS stocks them, but I don't trust myself to sex them when they're small like they are in the store.

 

[anewbie]

if you are going to have mix sex borelli; i'd drop the bolivian rams else you will likely ask for trouble - more likely dead borelli since hte rams are much larger...

 

[MacZ]

- Small school (3-5) of Otocinclus
- School (8-10) of Silver Tip Tetras
- Small school (4-6) Pencilfish of some type (trifasciatus or beckfordi)
- Pair or trio of Apistogramma borellii
- Pair of Bolivian Rams

Epos has learned well and said most things to consider.
In the dimensions of this tank I'd stick with a trio of male A. borellii.

But about the other fish:
- Add Otocinclus only after 6 months to make sure they have a well seasoned tank with plenty of biofilms and aufwuchs. Also add at least 5 or even 10, they do better in larger groups and a larger starting group ensures more survivals (yes, you will have losses. If not you'll be incredibly lucky)
- Hasemania nana is known to be nippy, rather look into Aphyocharax, paraguayensis or A. anisitsi, those come from the same river basin as A. borellii.
- For tetras and pencils don't take less than 10 each! Too small groups can cause aggression and they are all related to piranha. Then it will show.

 

[Mike Wise]

- Hasemania nana is known to be nippy, rather look into Aphyocharax, paraguayensis or A. anisitsi, those come from the same river basin as A. borellii.
- For tetras and pencils don't take less than 10 each! Too small groups can cause aggression and they are all related to piranha. Then it will show.

Your mention of Silver tips being nippy made me smile. In the 80s I had someone return one out of a school of 12. Why? Because it kept every other fish in a 60"/1.5m tank pressed into one side of the tank. It included same good sized angelfish. I'm sure this is atypical of the species, although they are 'boisterous'. This one fish was psycho!

With shooling fish (pencils don't school, but do congrigate together in preferred spots) it is true that 'the more the merrier'. I prefer >6 and preferably in odd numbers.

 

[BSMet94]

- Add Otocinclus only after 6 months to make sure they have a well seasoned tank with plenty of biofilms and aufwuchs. Also add at least 5 or even 10, they do better in larger groups and a larger starting group ensures more survivals (yes, you will have losses. If not you'll be incredibly lucky)
- Hasemania nana is known to be nippy, rather look into Aphyocharax, paraguayensis or A. anisitsi, those come from the same river basin as A. borellii.
- For tetras and pencils don't take less than 10 each! Too small groups can cause aggression and they are all related to piranha. Then it will show.

I shall take this advice (and the prior advice from Epos)! And thank you so much for the tetra recommendation... I am now in love with the Dawn Tetra. I have never come across A. paraguayensis, and they are exactly (even more, actually) what I was trying to look for in selecting the Silver Tip initially. I wanted something mesmerizing, with that little bit of flash with the white tipped fins in a schooling fish. The Dawn Tetras look to have that in spades! Thanks again!

 

[MacZ]

I shall take this advice (and the prior advice from Epos)! And thank you so much for the tetra recommendation... I am now in love with the Dawn Tetra. I have never come across A. paraguayensis, and they are exactly (even more, actually) what I was trying to look for in selecting the Silver Tip initially. I wanted something mesmerizing, with that little bit of flash with the white tipped fins in a schooling fish. The Dawn Tetras look to have that in spades! Thanks again!

A. paraguayensis have been in the hobby for a long time (I know someone who had them in the 70s), but between the early 80s and the early 2010s they seem to have been completely off the radar in the trade.

 

[anewbie]

A real favorite of mine are serpae tetra - as well as cardinals - neither might be suitable for your build. People complain about serpae being nippers but i've kept them with angels for 5 years now without issues - sometime a couple of serape and sometime (like now) a larger school of 16 - the only thing i'm finding is that the festums will go after the serpae and now and then catch one for dinner.

 

[BSMet94]

A real favorite of mine are serpae tetra - as well as cardinals

Cardinals have always been a favorite of mine as well. I tend to prefer keeping fish (and cars and motorcycles) that are a little bit out of the ordinary, but Cardinals are just classically awesome fish, even if you do see them in almost every fish store. They are hard to resist. This weekend, I made my family watch the "Wild Caught" documentary. My wife is originally from Brazil, and ever since we watched that, I've been joking that our next vacation needs to be Barcelos in January for the Festival do Peixe Ornamental, but she has to decide if she's on team Cardinal or team Acará-Disco! I'm rooting for the Cardinal!

 

[BSMet94]

A. paraguayensis have been in the hobby for a long time (I know someone who had them in the 70s), but between the early 80s and the early 2010s they seem to have been completely off the radar in the trade.

Well, thank you for putting them on my radar! I thought I was getting old. I only started in the hobby in the early 1980s, about age 10, with my first pair of swordtails, named George and Martha. I was shocked when they ate all their fry!

 

[Me&Fishy]

Well, thank you for putting them on my radar! I thought I was getting old. I only started in the hobby in the early 1980s, about age 10, with my first pair of swordtails, named George and Martha. I was shocked when they ate all their fry!

I would recommend pencil fish marilynae. They are much smaller and swin really fast. Best part, since they are small they wouldn't bother your apisto. Would advise to keep in a school of 8 to 10 pcs.

 

[MacZ]

I would recommend pencil fish marilynae. They are much smaller and swin really fast. Best part, since they are small they wouldn't bother your apisto. Would advise to keep in a school of 8 to 10 pcs.

Nannostomus marilynae need warmer and softer water than the rest. Availability is similarly problematic, though.

 

[BSMet94]

I'm terrible about follow-ups, but here is an update: we set up the 40B tank with a sand substrate, couple of rocks, a couple of clay pots, a branch left over from trimming our oak tree last year, and a handful of Jacaranda pods and magnolia leaves collected from the neighborhood. Started the tank with a large (new) sponge filter, and transferred a "dirty" (i.e. full of bacteria) running HOB filter from a long-established tank to the new tank. We then planted a bunch of Brazilian pennywort, dwarf sagitteria, ludwigia, and Amazon sword. The tank sat like that for a couple weeks, and we couldn't wait any longer for fish.

After searching around all the "good" independent LFS, and finding no Dawn tetras, or even anyone that had ever had them in the past, we stumbled across a Petco that had 6 Bloodfin tetras (Aphyocharax anisitsi), which we immediately scooped up. One of those died on the first night, and we lost another one a week later. After a week with that group, we observed them scattering eggs at dawn and dusk, and then proceeding to much on them all day long. We then convinced our favorite LFS to see if they could get us some more Bloodfins, and they came through for us. We added an additional 8 to the tank for a total of 12. I picked them up the same day that the LFS received them, and they were pretty stressed out, dull and just a hint of red in the fins. It was so cool to see them transform to their shiny iridescent silver and bright red fins over the course of just two days after we got them home! They've gotten along quite well for over a month now. We did lose one more of the original batch... the one that was scattering eggs got bloated up and started hanging out under the sponge filter full time. We removed her to an isolation tank, not knowing what was wrong with her and not wanting it to spread, and she only lasted another couple of days.

We started seeing algae growth, and it was getting really bad covering the pennywort leaves, and the plants were starting to die. For that, right or wrong, we added 4 Otocinclus to the tank. Within a couple of days, those guys worked really hard at cleaning up the plants, and now we're seeing lots of new growth without all that algae hogging all the sunlight! The Otos are also slowly taking care of getting rid of the unsightly fungus and whatnot on the oak branch. We were nervous about adding Otos so soon, but they seem to be thriving. So we will probably add a few more. Then we will think about possibly introducing a second tetra species or maybe some pencilfish. Then maybe by September we will be ready to finally graduate to our ultimate goal of keeping Apistogramma. We are still focusing on A. borellii. We finally have a somewhat local LFS with some A. borellii stock... it's a 3 hour drive away, but that's a shorter trip than getting them shipped in!

 

[MacZ]

For that, right or wrong, we added 4 Otocinclus to the tank. Within a couple of days, those guys worked really hard at cleaning up the plants, and now we're seeing lots of new growth without all that algae hogging all the sunlight! The Otos are also slowly taking care of getting rid of the unsightly fungus and whatnot on the oak branch. We were nervous about adding Otos so soon, but they seem to be thriving. So we will probably add a few more.

This is the only part that gives me a headache. Please do not add more of them. An appropriate number would be 10-15 of them and your tank will struggle supporting the 4 you have with aufwuchs and biofilms, just by the tank size. Also an important advice: When there is no aufwuchs visible anymore and Otocinclus seem especially busy, they are starving and desparately gnawing off any bit of biofilm they can find. The "fungus" is biofilm as well and would have been gone within a few weeks anyway. In any case, keep a keen eye on them and start supplemental feedings (leaf litter! organic cucumber, zucchini, lettuce, spinach, repashy soilent green, instant infusoria... and hope they identify any of those things as food) once their stomachs start to deflate.

As for the algae:
Algae phases come and go over the course of the first 6-10 months of a tank's runtime. Usually you do not have to do anything about it.
The Hydrocotyle was probably planted in the ground, I assume? It works best floating. That's probably the reason it didn't make it.

 

[Epos7]

We started seeing algae growth, and it was getting really bad covering the pennywort leaves, and the plants were starting to die.

My guess is you've been seeing diatom algae as that's especially common in the first month or two. The nice thing is diatoms can only survive about seven days before dying off, so if you just keep suctioning it off during water changes, it will disappear on its own as the tank stabilizes. With stem plants, you can also cut off the affected part of the plant, and replant the healthy growing tips.

 

[MacZ]

With stem plants, you can also cut off the affected part of the plant, and replant the healthy growing tips.

And Hydrocotyle can reproduce from a cuttling with just two leaves and a node with roots. Floating.