sunken apisto painted face

[uberape]

hello,
my male painted face has recently displayed the signs i have recognised as sick. He is hiding more often than not, he rests on the bottom, he scratches against a rock (no visable white spot) and seems a little passive towards the tetra that share his tank. The temperature is around 31 ish which is what they all seem to prefer, the ph is around 7.2 ish, there is no amonia, nitrite readings are good. it could be that my flat is cold at night now and the heater is not adjusting but I also think he is just bored. the tank is quite small 30-30-60 cm but so is he. I feed him blood worms and expensive crab food which every fish likes. please advise me as i cant lose him he has developed amazing black dots all over, (from a time when my light was bust) and i just like him and his apisto ways. I will get rid of the tetra if neccessary (3 big albino phantoms and one widow) they are too aggressive but it cant be the origin of his listlessness. pls help- martin

 

[Hmoobthor]

"crab food"....are not for cichlids.

Please go buy cichlids food made for them. Your is sick from eatting it.

 

[Mike Wise]

A. sp. "Painted-face/Carapintada" is a commercial name for both A. sp. Masken and A. sp. Winkelfleck/Angle-patch. These Peruvian jungle fish do best at between 24° and 27°C (75-80°F) and a pH below 7,0, preferably below 6,5. If your fish has a sunken belly, then my guess is that it has intestinal parasites; not good for small fish.

 

[uberape]

reply

yeah the crab food has the same ingredients as the cichlid food in the shop (i did check first) the only thing that is different is the shape, they are in little hoops. plus i mostly feed him bloodworms.

i dont get the temperature thing, if i pull the temp down to 27 the fish get stressed and begin scratching and if i put it up they are fine but it does seem too high but i cant seem to win. with the ph im trying to pull it down with peat in the filter but that doesnt work too well actually it keeps it at around 7, my tap water is naturally high at around 7.7. I was going to use the chemical ph lowerer but was advised to look for a permanent solution that doesnt crash the ph.

his stomach is not sunken he seems more just to rest on the bottom more thats what i mean, but he has now begun to spit out the bloodworms, i will buy the cichlid food anyway just incase but its not looking too good. thanks for the advice should i use the chemical ph lowerers?

 

[Hmoobthor]

yeah the crab food has the same ingredients as the cichlid food in the shop (i did check first) the only thing that is different is the shape, they are in little hoops. plus i mostly feed him bloodworms.

i dont get the temperature thing, if i pull the temp down to 27 the fish get stressed and begin scratching and if i put it up they are fine but it does seem too high but i cant seem to win. with the ph im trying to pull it down with peat in the filter but that doesnt work too well actually it keeps it at around 7, my tap water is naturally high at around 7.7. I was going to use the chemical ph lowerer but was advised to look for a permanent solution that doesnt crash the ph.

his stomach is not sunken he seems more just to rest on the bottom more thats what i mean, but he has now begun to spit out the bloodworms, i will buy the cichlid food anyway just incase but its not looking too good. thanks for the advice should i use the chemical ph lowerers?

if he is splitting out food, its not looking good. Best thing is to treat it in another tank ASAP.

 

[Mike Wise]

Try some live food. If he spits it out then he has major problems.

As for your water, it probably has too much alkalinity to permit peat to drop the pH. Your best bet is to mix distilled/RO water with your tap water. If you can get the dKH down, the peat should drop the pH below 7,0.

As for the temperature. Most Peruvian apistos live in waters that are shaded by the jungle. Measured temperatures are rarely above 30°C/86°F even during the dry season. During most of the year, their waters are around 22-25°C/72-77°F. For cold blooded animals, high temperatures are just as stressful as low temperatures. Such animals have what biologists call "upper and lower lethal limits. Above and below these temperatures, the bodily functions will start to break down and fail. I don't think that you have reached the 'upper lethal limit' for your fish, but I would think that it is stressful.

If this was my fish, the first thing that I would do is try to feed it some live food, only to test if it will eat. If it spits out live food, then I would treat it for possible internal parasites. If it does eat live food (and keeps it down), then I would slowly change the water over several days with cooler, softer, and more acid water. If the fish become more active, then continue this kind of maintenance.

 

[uberape]

thanks

yeah thanks mike, ill try that out