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The Beginning...

noddin0ff

New Member
5 Year Member
Messages
11
Hi all-

First let me start off with the usual noob stuff. I apologize for the wordiness.

I just started cycling a 95G Wave (48x24x25, AGA) with a dozen Danio's. Maybe another more colorful school of something else small. The tank has the AGA Mega overflow draining to a large sump (36x12.18in). I’m still twiddling with the plumbing, but I probably turn over about 140 gallons per hour of flow with the return pump through a couple nozzles, reef style, for returns. I'm starting some plants with flourite overlaid with pea gravel from Home Depot and have strong lighting since I bought this all (used) when thinking I might do a reef tank. I'm on just slightly soft well water, and after a lot of reading believe that S. Am. Dwarfs are the best fit for me. If all goes well, I'll eventually add CO2 but don't see it as necessary now. Rocks, caves etc are in development…. I’m hoping for a natural look but could use some excitement.

I think I’ve got room for two species to co-exist (3-5 fish each). My short list of preferred species is

Apistogramma agassizii
Apistogramma borrelii
Apistogramma cacatuoides
Apistogramma panduro or Apistogramma nijsseni
Microgeophagus ramirezi

I’ve seen some sad rams in a LFS and they looked a little un-natural to me but I suppose happy ones in a big tank would be pleasing. Probably most intriguing to me are agassizii, panduro (or nijsseni), and borrelii (or cacatuoides), with the 2nd runner ups in (parens). It would be cool if they successfully breed, but it’s not a make-or-break priority for me now. I’ll do my best. I choose these species because, from my reading, they seem to be more available and on the easier side of the spectrum.

For tank mates, I’ll probably keep about a dozen danio’s. I’d like to add a school of Cory’s. And I’ve always liked Silver Dollar fish for the middle because they are such dramatic swimmers. But, I hear they are piggy eaters and will mow down the plant life. So, maybe I’ll try some Angles later if they are OK with strong flow? …and possibly a pleco if algae gets bad. The tank has good height so I want somebody in the middle.

…so, what are my questions?

I’d appreciate compatibility comments. I was reading another thread about harem vs. non-harem which was a level I hadn’t considered. Since I haven’t landscaped yet I intend to set up two distinct territories. Any additional species recommendations? Or comments on numbers and sex ratios?

I was also wondering where good places to get fish are. The Boston area is closest but a bit of a drive for me, so I’d consider mail order to get the fish I like as well.

Thanks for reading.
 

apistoireland

New Member
5 Year Member
Messages
62
Location
Cork, Ireland
Hi,
Apistos are not that hectic on a strong flow either. You will also get a better plant growth if you tune down the flow a bit.
Silver dollars are a no go area with apistos. Too hectic a fish and they get to big as well.
I have kept apistos with angels even though you would want to be careful. Especially with fish bred in SE Asia. They are sponges for pathogenes. That's why I wouldn't keep angels with discus either.
A. borelli, njissseni and panduro do better in pairs. Buy groups of juveniles if you can and pairs will form in due course. the same goes for the rams. With the other species you will be better off keeping them in harems. One male with several females. The males aren't picky when it comes to partner selection.
I wouldn't introduce a plec either. Firstly, they aren't great to eat algae, most preferring a meaty diet and that will include any apisto wggs. Try a shoal of octocinlus. They actually eat algae and a very peaceful. But you will need quite a few.

hope that helps
 

noddin0ff

New Member
5 Year Member
Messages
11
Thanks for the reply, it was helpful. Especially pointing me toward the oto's. I hadn't thought of them. I don't particularly like plecos and it sounds like otocinclus has size and schooling behavior like Cory's. Win-win. I certainly can wait until I get good algea for them though.

I'm wondering who might be good dealers/breaders to get apisto's from online? I'd prefer to get tank raised fish whenever possible.

edit- nobody can help a newbie find a good source for Apisto?
 

AdamT

New Member
5 Year Member
Messages
52
Location
Minneapolis
I've had panduro in the past, and it was trouble. My male kept killing off his girlfriends. =( Then, with nobody around to try to impress he'd get kind of dull in coloration. He offed three females, and then I took him back to the store. Maybe I just happened to pick the psycho one. I like caucatoides, aggasizzi (after they've colored up in a good tank), and borelli from the group you stated.

Common plecos get big and kinda gross, I aggree. I keep having trouble trying to get a group of oto's to live in my tanks tho. My most recent attempts involved bringing 2 groups of 5 to my 55 ga. I took out a 4 in. long temniki (sp?) and started introducing otos. Of 10 oto's put in after a month there were 2 remaining. Now there is only one. With no one around to take care of it, very quickly alge overran the tank, and now I'm still battling it. D=

I say pick up a pleco variety that is a good algae eater and doesn't get too big. A knowledgable fish store clerk could help you find one. If you want your apistos to breed provide them with a small and easily defended breeding site. Mine regularly manage to make babies in a 1.5 in. diameter ceramic tube that is made to look like a log. The 4 or 5 in. temniki in the tank with them can't fit into the log.

Problems I haven't solved:
keeping oto's alive past the 1st week
serial murderer panduro

Maybe there are some simple answers to these, but I haven't found 'em yet.

-A
 

noddin0ff

New Member
5 Year Member
Messages
11
Yeah, I've read that oto's frequently experience a die off after you introduce them. Seems most recommend building up a lot of algea, introducing a group hope for the best, and start feeding blanched veggies before the algea is all gone. But it sounds like heavy losses are the norm, which is sad because I think they're mostly wild caught.
 

apistoireland

New Member
5 Year Member
Messages
62
Location
Cork, Ireland
Adam seems to have had a panduro that needed to see a shrink. Never had any problems with them. Keep 3 pairs in a 66 gal tank and never got that kind of aggression. you might want to consider A. nijsseni. Almost look the same as panduros and from my experience are a good bit hardier.

I add nettles or spinach to my food mix so they probaly eat that and get their feed. There are different species of Oto. O. vittatus seems a bit harder then O. affinis. That's what I hear. I have both species and never had any trouble with either of them.
 

noddin0ff

New Member
5 Year Member
Messages
11
apistoireland said:
Adam seems to have had a panduro that needed to see a shrink. Never had any problems with them. Keep 3 pairs in a 66 gal tank and never got that kind of aggression. you might want to consider A. nijsseni. Almost look the same as panduros and from my experience are a good bit hardier.

I add nettles or spinach to my food mix so they probaly eat that and get their feed. There are different species of Oto. O. vittatus seems a bit harder then O. affinis. That's what I hear. I have both species and never had any trouble with either of them.

Good tips, thanks!
 

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