silver hatchetfish

[aspen]

not a dwarf cichlid i know but...

i read in the baensch atlas today that these guys get to 3 1/2"!! has anybody seen these fish that big, and esp, have you ever raised them so big? what did you feed them, how did you keep them?

rick

 

[mk_ultra]

3.5"! Wow. When I was in the Army we use to feed our guard dogs MREs and A-Rats in Honduras. Biggest dogs I've ever seen. maybe you can try that.
i would also try fruit flies :lol:

 

[aspen]

at last count i am keeping about 25 species of fish. my wifes fav is the discus, and her next fav are these hatchets. they actually do a good job of keeping the top clean and never go below mid level, so are good with apistos. and they are very active. so, as a tetra, they are a good apisto tankmate. when they are 3", well, i don't know. i'll see if i can grow them out that big.

rick

 

[Psilocybin]

I'm thinking of getting 7 marbled hatchets for my 29gallon, from what I understand they don't get nearly as big as the silver hatchets. I've seen some big silvers (about 2 1/2") but no 3 1/2" ones.

 

[aspen]

read up on the differences in the hatchetfish. marbled like their water a little cooler, and are quite timid. i have never bought any of these. silver's are less timid and prefer warmer water, ie, better for the s/a dwarf tank. however i prefer the look of the marbled.

i like my hatchetfish, they provide some activity right at the top of the tank. watch for JUMPING!! you can never turn your back on the tank for a minute with the top open.

rick

 

[ancientaquarist]

Silver Hatchets-size

rble hatchets in my new 125 gal. community tank with discus and apistos.

I had never heard of the "Common Hatchet" so possibly it is simply a somewhat modified clone of the silver.

Will marbles have problems at 82 degrees F? What about the following at that temperature:
Aequidens maroni
festivums
discus
cardinal tets
black neons
algae eaters
six or seven different genera of dwarf cichlids

 

[ancientaquarist]

The beginning of my post.

In a book I've been reading they show one fish as "Silver Hatchets" which match those I raised in the 1950s. The largest was 2.5" after a year and they lived six years.

This book also shows another species (almost identical) called by the author "Common Hatchet Fish." It's body is not as deep as the silver and according to the author they reach 3" and are the best "flyers" of the family.

Never heard of this fish but will search my library for page numbers.
Will "Silver Hatchets" tolerate a temperature of 82 degrees F? What about marbled..................

 

[2la]

There is no such thing as a cooler temperature requirement for hatchets. All of them will do fine at 82F.

 

[ancientaquarist]

The size of hatchet fishes and their use with dwarf cichlids

In The Complete Aquarist's Guide to Freshwater Tropical Fishes, 2nd edition, 1978-editor John Gilbert Golden Press, NY three hatchet fishes are named and described with the following sizes indicated:

Carnegiella strigata "Marble Hatchet Fish" 2" usual description with indication that its habitat is soft, acidic water with temperature of 82F-86F

Gasteropelecus levis "Silver Hatchet" usual description. 2.5-3" soft acid water. Temperature 82F.

Gasteropelecus sternicula "Common Hatchet Fish" the photos indicate that the latter two species are identical except for dentition. Usual description,
2.0" Temperature 84F soft, acidic waters.

I kept "Silver Hatchets" for almost ten years. The largest was perhaps 2.25" but 2" is normal. I never heard of so-called G. sternicula. Appears identical to levis with perhaps a bit less deep body. Soft, acid waters
temperature 84F

They obviously inhabit the warmest strata, the surface and there water and temperature requirements suggest a school of 5-7 should do beautifully with apistos and other Neotropical dwarf cichlids. There only special requirements are floating food "Gilbert suggests vestigial wing fruit flies) and a very tight cover on the tank. I can personally attest that they jump at the first opportunity. I feel a good layer of floating plants would somewhat discourage jumping.

 

[ancientaquarist]

Hatchet fish mystery solved.

To Aspen and the Group:
Well guys, guess what---there are many more hatchet fishes, one of which is in the trade in Germany.

genus: Thorococharax securis "Giant Hatchet Fish" The least available because it transports badly. Looks like a large Silver Hatchet except there are areas of lavender pink and black markings on the tail and near huge pectoral fins. Description conforms. Size 3.5-3.75". Needs a large tank 55 gallons +. Soft, slightly acid water at 80F-84F. Minimum school 5 fish. Completely peaceful and will not eat its own fry or others. Prefers mosquito larve.

The other 3 species I wrote about earlier are believed to "fly" to escape predation. Giant Hatchet Fishes have been seen to leap and snatch flying insects out of the air. An excellent companion to dwarf and smaller gentle
cichlids restricted to the surface. Terrible jumper. Achtung!

I've never seen it but I want it and will look for it in Germany during August 2005. I love doing this kind of research and hope you enjoy it with me.

 

[2la]

There are a few other 'traditional' hatchetfish species out there:

Gasteropelecus maculatus
Carnegiella schereri
Carnegiella myersi
Carnegiella marthae

Species of the genus Triportheus are also known as hatchetfish, and to add to the confusion, a genus of cyprinid (Chela) also contains fish that are commonly referred to as hatchetfish.

 

[fideltagamma]

Hatchets are one of my favourite characins. I keep at least 10 individuals in a school of characins though I prefer schools over 15. Sadly hatchets are not widely available here in Hungary and the last time I could only get the last 11 at my LFS. They are Carnegiella myersi, and this species doesn't grow big, I think they grow only to 1-1.25'. They definitely show a lot of activity at the upper reaches. Though at the moment they don't try to escape, but previously I had problems with their flying abilities.

Daniel

 

[ancientaquarist]

Help! I can feel a fish room about to emerge.

Now I am starting to want multiple tanks-one for anabantids, one for dwarf neotropical ciclids, a complete collection of hatchet fish, a breeding tank or two-30 gallons, a quarantine tank, a talk for plant propagation, and a fifty gallon tank based on our tap water-75F-poecilia veilifera and ?
A long, long low tank for corys and marble hatchets. Help. I don't normally have an addictive personality except when it comes to plants,
animals, books and recordings.

 

[cootwarm]

I purchased what was supposed to be Marbled Hatchetfish from an LFS and they turned out to be Carnegiella marthae. They were great little fish but it had been awhile since I had hatchetfish and it took me too long to break my habit of leaving the tank top open after feeding! In less than one week all 6 jumped out of the tank! :cry:

I haven't been able to get any more Carnegiella marthae since.
I had to settle for the real Marbled Hatchetfish but I'm still watching out for more Carnegiella marthae. I finally got myself conditioned to close the lids when done feeding!

Michael

 

[ancientaquarist]

Jumpers-we all lose.

Michael-
When the thread of hatchet fishes came up I immediately became involved because I kept "Silver Hatchets" back in the 1950s and always found them beautiful and interesting fishes and wonderful contributors to a community tank.

I did however warn about their jumping. Over the years I lost 4 - in a decade - by opening the glass lid and not shutting it instantly. What was surprising is that I always grew a dense layer of water ferns and myriophyllum which seemed to keep other jumpers-danios, platies, swordtails from being interested in jumping.

However I have been researching this group a lot since the first post. They can fly, using their pectoral fins like wings and although they usually jump to avoid being attacked from below several species are known to jump in pursuit of prey.

Can you tell us about marthae? What is special about the species? I plan on 5 "Marble Hatchets" in my new community aquarium-Caenagiella
striata. They are also the only species readily available in Tucson and apparently fairly free spawners. I also like their size and markings.

I will have no other jumpers but plan to be vigilant. Sterba writes that huge schools of several species are often seen where there are low flying insects with dozens leaping out to catch their snack at once. I hope you can find the species you seek and keep them well covered.

 

[M0oN]

With a well planned feeding regimen and ideal water conditions from early age any fish can grow well past what the normal size is.

I've seen silver hatchetfish that are close to 3 1/2" but not quite, it's fairly hard to judge since they have a rounded body yet are so small.

My local fish store has 12" bosemani rainbow and praecox close to 5" right now...

Alls it takes is a very large tank dedicated to a singular species and a varied diet that resembles the diet of the fish in the wild...easier said then done.

 

[2la]

My local fish store has 12" bosemani rainbow and praecox close to 5" right now...

WHOA...You HAVE to get a picture of that, with something next to the fish (ruler?) for a size comparison! Forgive my incredulity, but with measurements that freakish I really would have to see it to believe it! 8O

 

[M0oN]

My local fish store has 12" bosemani rainbow and praecox close to 5" right now...

WHOA...You HAVE to get a picture of that, with something next to the fish (ruler?) for a size comparison! Forgive my incredulity, but with measurements that freakish I really would have to see it to believe it! 8O

I'll work on it, unfortuantely my digital camera is a dinosaur and has a short in it, battery's drain after one picture and even then it usually doesn't get enough juice to save the picture to the card...

I'll have to borrow one from a friend, they really are an incredible site...at $125 for a single bosemani though it better be! Somewhat funny to watch a pair of convicts shy away from a rainbowfish...

 

[ancientaquarist]

A question on genus Carnagiella

Hi, all- I hope we "Hatchet Fish" enthusiasts aren't boring the dwarf cichlidopiles to death. I enjoy them so much-of the real upper strata schoolers I know no real competition. I have yet another question-Is
C. myersi synonymous with C. marthae??

I know that Dr. Myers named the "Black Winged Hatchet" marthae because they were his "wife's favorite." I also have noticed that Dr. Axelrod was forced to report that hatchets do "fly" and that this was scientifically researched and the whirring sounds produced by their incredibly rapid flapping of their pectoral fins recorded. Is this recording available? How?

Axelrod says that this recording proved that these little guys are the only real "flying fishes." This makes them even more intriguing. Is there an amateur or professional taxonomist on our forum?? How many valid spp. are there in genera Carnegiella and Gasteropelecus? What are their current names?

Finally, is there a "characin website?" TIA!

 

[M0oN]

http://www.oceans.gov.au/norfanz/images/doriesMN.jpg

Are these considered hatchetfish?