member of steindachneri group??

[a.d.wood]

Hi folks,

Any one want to guess what these are??

Received from Brazil on Tuesday this week, initial thoughts are thatthey are probably a member of the steindachneri group, they're a good size with a couple hitting about 5 to 6cm SL:

They were marked as Apistogramma mandense on the list (and weren't what we expected/hoped for when they arrived!!)

Andrew

 

[a.d.wood]

and the oddballl that was with the fish pictured above is??

Hi there,

This fish was in the same bag as the above, any thoughts??

The caudal fin is lyrate and no visible extensions on the front rays of the dorsal fin when it's erect.

Andrew

 

[blueblue]

There are two species:

1. The first species, as shown in your first thread, is probably
A. Hippolytae (characterized by the two-dots), belonging to the Steindachneri group.

2. The second species, as shown in your second thread, is
A. Gibbiceps.

 

[a.d.wood]

Hi BlueBlue,

Yes, initial thoughts were centerted on either A. rupununi, A. hippolytae or at least a closely related species. Now we just have to hope that there were a few females in the shipment!!

I had looked at A. gibbiceps for the second fish, but had steered away from that as it clearly has caudal fin extensions, but no extensions or separartion to the front dorsal rays. On looking at other pictures in the books though looks like this is just a young fish and the dorsal fin features are yet to develop.

Thanks

Andrew

 

[KenL]

1. Could they not just be A.steindachneri?

2. I think this is A.gibbiceps - the marks low on the body certainly look the same as gibbiceps.

 

[a.d.wood]

Hi Ken,

With the images of A. steindachneri I have seen, the males have lyrate tails. With these guys the tails are rounded. These fish came out of Brazil, Datz reports A. steindachneri distribution as Guyana/Suriname/Venezuela (what's the chances of fish from these countries being shipped out through Brazil??).

Andrew

 

[blueblue]

1. Could they not just be A.steindachneri?

2. I think this is A.gibbiceps - the marks low on the body certainly look the same as gibbiceps.

1. Hmm... i would say that the fish in the first and the last photos
of the first thread are probably A. Hippolytae.

2. Agree, and i am 100% certain that the fish is gibbiceps.

 

[KenL]

Hi Ken,

With the images of A. steindachneri I have seen, the males have lyrate tails. With these guys the tails are rounded. These fish came out of Brazil, Datz reports A. steindachneri distribution as Guyana/Suriname/Venezuela (what's the chances of fish from these countries being shipped out through Brazil??).

Andrew

Here are pics of ones I had. Really nice fish. The male which was pretty big, had what I would say was a truncated tale, not lyrate.

Not doubting being something other than steindachneri but they are obviously closely related.

 

[a.d.wood]

Hi Ken,

I think the problem (maybe even fault) we have now is that there are that many different fish coming into the hobby with slight differences from what we expect we start to question whether it is a new species and ignore the fact that it is probably just a regional variation of what we already have

Thanks for your input

Andrew

 

[Mike Wise]

blueblue is absolutely correct on both fish. The lower fish in the third photo looks like a female to me. A. hippolytae has a larger flank patch & caudal spot than those on either A. steindachneri or A. rupununi. A. hippolytae often has the cheek stripe reduced to an "eye spot" on the bottom of the gill cover.