Congochromis sabinae breeding success

[westafrica]

The Tsuhapa locality can be added to the ones mentioned by Randall for C. sabinae.

BTW Hi Randall . Do you still have the pics of P. taeniatus I had sent to you about one year ago for the website?

 

[Randall]

Congochromis sabinae

Hello Westafrica,

We need to be very careful when assuming that a taxon bearing an informal association like "Tschuapa," "Lobe," "Bangui," "Shiloango," etc. denotes a specific locality from which a subject fish is collected. Often this is not the case. Anton Lamboj notes, for example, that Pelvicachromis taeniatus "Kienke" and P. taeniatus "Nange" were collected at the same locality, in the same creek, in 1989 and sometime in the 1970s respectively. We are talking about the exact same fish bearing two different names! In another instance, female Pelvicachromis subocellatus "Matadi" and P. subocellatus "Moanda" from the lower Congo drainage exhibit different coloration, with the "Moanda" form generally considered to be the more colorful of the two. The wild P. subocellatus offered for the past few years as "Monada," however, are actually collected around Boma, which is considerably closer to Matadi than to Moanda!

I think it best to recognize informal designations and associations for what they are: terms of convenience that may or may not denote anything about the natural distribution of a fish.

Anton Lamboj described Congochromis sabinae from northeastern parts of Gabon, central regions in Congo (Brazzaville) west of the Congo River, and northern parts of the Dem. Rep. of the Congo around Genema and Bamanya. This vast expanse surely includes the River Tschuapa and a myriad of other potential localites. The taxon is valid, however, as Congochromis sabinae.

I'm happy to discuss your photos with you privately.

All the best,

Randall Kohn

 

[westafrica]

Hi Randall!

Thanks for these detailed message.

I agree with you on that point of the need to know the precise locations where our fish are caught, to keep the strains clean and to increase the accuracy of our knowledge. The Kienke / Nange case for instance shows that necessity very well, some people having certainly kept fish bought under those 2 names apart from each other, whether they are collected in the same exact location. Some more complex cases such as Lobe (river) / Nyete (locality about 15kms south to the Lobe) also shows that most of the time the fishing localities are inacurate, putting rivers and "dots" on the same plan, which already gave me a few headaches .

If I added Tsuhapa to your list, it is only because A. Lamboj mentioned Tsuhapa as a geographical form of C. sabinae in a conversation I had with him and in further mail exchanges. I wouldn't have dared adding it based only on a stocklist I would have seen, considering the especially high imprecision / falseness of the commercial names for Congochromis, mentioned below in that thread. I know it is not ideal, bur still if it allows to distinguish a population of C. sabinae from others, it's better than nothing (this is my opinion, I'm not quoting Anton Lamboj on this last point).

Best regards,

Jérôme

 

[westafrica]

My C. sabinae spawned again last Friday, approx. 1 week after I removed the fry and the day after I changed almost half of the water.

 

[westafrica]

Since yesterday : about 50 tiny (3mm) fry are swimming with both parents :wink: . It's earlier than I expected. I hope they will grow up as successfully as the last ones, so that the strain can be spread to as many people as possible!

@a.d. wood : how are your's doing?

 

[a.d.wood]

@a.d. wood : how are your's doing?

Hi Jérôme,

My batch are doing very well, the main suprise is growth rate which, when compared with my Nanochromis parilus is much faster.

I also have free swimming fry from my Congochromis dimidiatus, unfortunately I lost the female 2 days after the fry became free swimming (not sure why, no marks on her :frown: ), however the male seems to have taken to brood care duties very well. Find this a bit suprising when the female actually evicted him from the spawning cave for about 7 days and he was only permitted back in again when the fry became free swimming!!

Andrew

 

[westafrica]

Thanks for your reply Andrew.

I'm sorry about your dimidiatus female . Despite this loss it's a good thing that the male is proving able to take care of the fry.

I'm surprised to learn that your Congochromis do grow faster than your parilus. If my memories as exact, parilus fry in my tanks reached 1cm within 3 weeks, whereas it took 4-5 weeks to my sabinae to reach that size. Maybe the slow growth rate of mine can be explained by the fact that they haven't been fed correctly for one week at a critical point because I was not there to feed them. I'll tell you when I see how fast the new batch is growing, I should be able to take care of them more properly.

BTW have your fry grown in autonomy as fast as in size, as we were discussing it at the beginning of this thread?

Last thing : don't you think it would be appropriate to rename the topic to "C. sabinae" or "Congochromis sp. breeding" (or whatever name you think is more appropriate, it's your topic

Best regards,

Jérôme

 

[a.d.wood]

Hi Jérôme,

The C. sabinae pair are doing a good job of keeping the brood together, any stragglers are soon gathered back into the main brood.

I tried to rename the thread, and either I'm missing something simple or it is not possible for me to rename a thread (only individual post titles), will PM a mod for help/advice.

Andrew

 

[westafrica]

Hi Andrew,

With the second batch I can also notice an improvement in fry gathering, even though some "burning heads" are already trying to begin exploring the vast world by themselves... Maybe the formation of an "independent" group of fry was partly a result of the parent's inexperience.

To gather the fry, do your C. sabinae take them in their mouth, and if so how many (maximium) at the time? Who is the most active in this gathering activity? Male or femele?

Thanks in advance

Jérôme

 

[westafrica]

Hi,

Some news : I moved the second bunch of fry to another tank this week end, because the male was chasing the female to guard the fry alone. I had never seen him be that violent, even though it was still far less violent than what I could observ with N. tranvestitus for instance (no fin shredding, no "seek & destroy" behavior), he just hit her when she was in sight.

Now, 2 days later, the female has regained her colors, and is tolerated most of the time.

Regarding the fishes of the second bunch, I can now tell which are males and females. The criteria I used til then are confirmed : striped caudal fin = male, transparent cadal fin = female.

Hope it helps. Andrew : what about yours?

 

[Lenny Llambi]

My fish are still a bit young, but I think that a pair is developing. The female is finally showing her "silver pearl". Very cool!

 

[westafrica]

Good news Lenny! FYI on the biggest females of the first bunch of fry I had, the silver scale appeared at 3-4 months of age. On the most little ones, it hasn't appeared yet, despite the fact that they are obviously females. Maybe it can help you estimate the age of yours... If the silver scale just appeared on your female, it is likely that she is approx. 3-5 months old provided her development is similar to mine's. Therefore if this estimation is valid, yours are probably "teenagers", and you will have to wait a few months before seing their first spawn. The displaying behavior appears much earlier though, and it is a great show to watch them flirt!

Could you please post some pics of yours? I would be very interested in comparing their general outline and their color patterns with mine.

Thanks in advance!

 

[ste12000]

I joined the Congochromis club last month when i bought a pair of Andrews Sabinae at auction..These will be what you call teenagers at about 3 months old, What a size they are...a very quick grower when you compare them to andrews first pictures in this thread and these pictures now..Stunning fish and i look forward to posting some pictures of my first fry soon.