Cac's spawned - what now?

[guppygirl]

Hello All,

This is my first time breeding A. cacatuoides. I just wanted to know if I should do a water change while the female is guarding eggs/wrigglers and what food to start the babies on once I get them into the grow-out tank. Also, what food is best for grow out.

I have a 10 gallon grow out ready to go and am willing to set up something larger later. My pair of cac's are with 7 gold tetras in a 10 gallon with 4 caves (3 coconut, 1 slate cave). pH is 7, temp is 78 F, I have not tested the hardness. The breeding tank is heavily planted (real and plastic plants) with course gravel. I've been feeding them flake, frozen brine shrimp, and freeze dried tubifex, blood worms and "cichlid pellets." The pair spawned sometime today or last night (I assume) and the female is guarding the smallest cave, staying inside it most of the time and coming out occasionally to graze or chase away the tetras. The male is keeping his distance (usually he chases her around and flares up, today he's staying away and seems really hungry). I intend to siphon the babies into the 10 gallon grow out when I see them free swimming (if the tetras dont get to them first). The ten gallon has a sponge filter (I've got guppies in there right now to cycle it) which I hope they can feed off of initially. What else should I do between now and then? Should I start a culture of bbs, or wait a couple weeks since they will be very small. Any commercial products you suggest?

 

[dw1305]

Hi Guppy girl,
First up congrats on the spawn, I wouldn't worry about your water hardness, the fish seem happy, and A. cacatuoides is tolerant of harder water than most S. American dwarfs. My first port of call would be ApistoBobs pages, the pages on water, cover etc are great:

<http://www.dwarfcichlid.com/index.php>

Can you move the Gold Tetras? I'm not sure what they are like with Apistos, but if there isn't much cover they may eat all the fry, or the female may be able to do quite a lot of damage to them while they're trying, also keep an eye on your male as they are really harem brooders, and again things could turn nasty at fairly short notice.

10 US? gallons is a fairly small tank already for that bioload. I'd change 25% water a day straight away, assuming you've got a water supply that isn't too cold or has too many nitrates?, again probably refer to Bob's pages, many of us change at least 10% water a day at all times .

I feed microworms, but baby A. cacs can manage BBS pretty well straight away. A well matured sponge and a large clump of Java moss is useful as well, as they find all sorts of bits in the biofilm to eat.

cheers Darrel

 

[guppygirl]

water changes - check

Thanks for the tips. I did a 30% water change tonight and will continue to do so daily here on out. I'm doubtful I can get the tetras out without turning the tank upside down (so many plants and caves) and stressing out the female. Any tips on how to get them out? I'll keep a close eye on it. Both parents seem to be defending the cave today (the male from the outside, he doesn't enter the cave). The tetras don't seem to be interested in entering the cave (I've never seen them go in any of the caves) - is this species very predatory? I believe they are Hemigrammus rodwayi. If I manage to get the tetras out and keep the babies in the main tank, will the gravel be a problem? I've gotten baby guppies stuck in that tank's gravel before, and am afraid I'll lose the apisto fry the same way. Do you recommend trying it, or just siphoning the little ones into the bare bottomed grow out tank as soon as I see them (the grow out tank is located direction beneath the main tank, so I don't think this will be problematic). I'm ok with trial and error on this spawn, but I'd like to forestall any obvious problems.

 

[dsjohn]

removing tetras

Hi guppy girl,

A simple trick for removing tetra & other dithers is to leave your net in the water with a clear path to the glass & occasionally drop some food in front of it. Just occasionally come by & squirt some food & you should get them quickly. I use an eye-dropper that came with a test kit fitted with a short lenth of air hose to position a small number of blood worms where I want them. It's also useful for delivering food down to wherever the fry are hanging out. I've used frozen cyclops as a commercial food-seems to be a bit smaller than bbs.

Good luck

 

[dw1305]

Hi Guppygirl,
I don't think the fry will get stuck in the gravel, although I always have sand in my tanks. I think problems may come when the female is leading the fry around the tank, in that the Tetras may try to pick them off, with a poor result either for them or the fry dependent upon how aggressive the female is.

If I siphoned the fry, I'd keep the mother with them. I also don't like bare bottom tanks, although other uses them. It might be all right if the bottom of the tank painted in a dark colour, and you can move lots of java moss etc. with them of add some leaf litter (have a look through the old posts for suggestions).

cheers Darrel

 

[guppygirl]

tetras removed

Ok, with much uprooting of plants and coordination of nets my husband and I got the all the tetras out.They are now adjusting to their exile with their old friends the guppies in the "grow out tank."

It appears the female did not become too upset during the ordeal (she stayed in her cave the whole time), and I'm hoping she didn't eat the fry.

As an update, two nights ago she moved her fry (?) to a larger coconut cave with a sunken bottom ( this makes sense since I read they like to keep the fry in pits in the substrate). She hasn't brought them out yet (I can't see the bottom of the cave to confirm they are there) and I assume they are not yet free swimming. I've been feeding her frozen brine shrimp, shrimp pellet, flake and today frozen cyclops. She has been coming out to eat, getting mouthfulls, re-entering the cave while still "chewing." I'm assuming she is providing food for the babies this way. Its so fascinating to watch. The male stays near and was helping guard while the tetras were in the tank (and during the great net massacre about an hour ago). I think he feels a little useless now. Should I be concerned about removing him too?

I have a jar of brine shrimp eggs cooking so hopefully I can feed them if I see them tomorrow. Should I wait until they are out of the cave to feed the bbs? Or should I use an eye dropper to squirt some bbs into the cave?

One more thing, the main tank where I'll be keeping them for the first month now has a power filter, should I be concerned about the babies getting sucked into the intake? I can close it off with some bring shrimp netting if I need to but I do not know if this is necessary.

 

[dw1305]

Hi Guppygirl,
Sounds promising, I'm sure she thought that was a better cave.
She should bring the fry out soon. The fry keep near the bottom, but I probably would cover the intake.

I use a sponge over the intake of a powerhead, it stops them being sucked up and they can have a peck at it, all sorts of good stuff - rotifers, nematodes etc in/on the sponge.
cheers Darrel

 

[Mike Wise]

For apistos it takes 3 days for the eggs to hatch and an additional 4 days for the larvae to become freeswimming fry. I wouldn't try to feed the fry until you see them swimming.

 

[guppygirl]

cigars for everyone

Yay, the babies are out and freeswimming. I was getting a little worried there because its been 8 days since the eggs were laid but when I came home today the fierce little mama is definitely hearding around a lot of very tiny babies. Thanks everyone for the tips!

 

[Mud Pie Mama]

WOOHOO!!! Always exciting to see those tiny babies and their smart, protective Mama doing a great job. Nature at its' best.

Congrats on a successful spawning.