A. Agasizii F1 ID

[Alex92]

After discussing the species again with breeders, it apears that they don't agree in saying it's an A. sp. Tefe.
So I'm back to ID'ing...

They do agree that the wavy lines on the flanks are specific to that species but according to them, there are other factors that don't fit in:
- the caudal fin is very pointy towards the back whereas sp. Tefe is round shaped (I verified this in the Cichlid Atlas v2 photos)
- the colour patron isn't similar to sp. Tefe (but from what I've read, I don't think colour is relevant...)

For these reasons, those maintaining this strain (i.e. other F1 couples of the same wild couple) like to call them: Apistogramma cf. agassizii tefe "Mutum"
This confuses me since, as explained several posts above, agassizii and sp. tefe are known to be separate species, though closely related.
According to those breeders, this choice of name would mean that it's an apisto that looks a bit like tefe but also a bit like agassizii but it's probably something else...
Does this make any sense?


Oh, and just for the follow-up, a few close-up pics of the fry:

 

[Mike Wise]

the caudal fin is very pointy towards the back whereas sp. Tefe is round shaped (I verified this in the Cichlid Atlas v2 photos)

Obviously, I've must have seen more photos of this species than you. The caudal fin varies as the fish ages. It grows more pointed as it gets larger/older. Many photos in books tend to show younger fish that do not show fully developed fins.

the colour patron isn't similar to sp. Tefe (but from what I've read, I don't think colour is relevant...)

I am not a big fan of using color for species identification for agassizii-complex species. All tend to be polychromatic - often with 2 or more color morphs occurring at the same collecting location. I tend to prefer using dark marking. It really doesn't matter much what name you use for the fish. Just explain the problem and let the buyers decide once they see the fish.

 

[Alex92]

It's been awhile and tanks have been moved around a bit... but seeing this same F1 female spawn over and over again is always as fascinating:

I'm getting mostly males though... any idea what I can do to get more females?
pH is 5.2, perhaps getting it a bit higher can help? Or would that be lower? Any input welcome....

 

[regani]

Uwe Römer has done a study (in Cichlid Atlas I) looking at the influence of pH and temperature on male/female ratios in various apistos. for A. agassizii he found:

23°C 26°C 29°C
pH 4.5 42% m 60% m 90% m
pH 5.5 77% m - 73% m ( - means experiment not done)

for A. agassizii there seems to be not as pronounced a trend as for some other species, but according to that data it may be worthwhile trying lower pH and temperature?


edit: hm, had the above laid out nicely in a table, but when I posted all the spaces disappeared. I hope it is still readable...

 

[FIL]

Hello; I am not surprised by the réaction of these breeders who tend To change the names of fish at their leisure to sell more easily . The problem is they are creating hybrids voluntary or involuntary, which is damaging To the species. Mike said as color cannot be a reliable identifier and until the fish be scientifically described, it must be called Apistogramma sp. Tefé A243. I breed this species "Magnifique" ; -)

 

[Ruki]

Those are my A. sp. "Tefe". Dark brown rows at male are cleary seen when he is angry.

 

[FIL]

Superbe !

 

[Ruki]

Superbe !

I forgot to write- fish are mine, but photos were made by peterK.

 

[Gwendal]

Wonderful pics, love wild ones.
Great job with the fry!






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