pls help to id apisto

[Melvin_Lim]

hi folks,

just got this fella on easter friday. as the tank had a mixed group of apistos, i'm not too sure what i got actually.
would appreciate if anyone here could give me some clues.

thanks

pics here

male: http://www.petfrd.com/pp/showphoto.php?photo=2105

female : http://www.petfrd.com/pp/showphoto.php?photo=2106

 

[Fisherking]

Hi, the two photos are not of the same spices. The one you say is the male is probebly apistogramma meniken and the female is gibbiceps.

 

[Melvin_Lim]

thanks fisherking.
i think you are right about the second pic being a female gibbiceps.
as for the 1st pic, can't find any info on the net about meniken.

 

[Mike Wise]

My bet is that your "female" will develop a lyretail & slighly extended front dorsal spines. In other words, I think that it is a young male A. gibbiceps. The male probably is not the true A. meinkeni (a very rare fish, even in the wild). It is more likely that it is A. cf. pertensis (a.k.a. A. cf. meinkeni). The real A. meinkeni is very small (<5 cm/2"), and also shows a well-marked spot (on Bar 2) in front of the lateral spot and an anal patch. These are not seen on A. cf. pertensis. Neither are seen on the photos, but this doen not mean that they are not present. More photos will be needed to be sure.

Mike Wise

 

[Melvin_Lim]

thanks Mike

if they happen to be both males, they would fit nicely into my planned com tank

will keep an eye on the aggression and post updated pics once they get bigger and coloured up for better id.

cheers
melvin

 

[Rolo]

Hi,

I have another guess... th first one could also be a dwarf form from the A. pertensis relationship. How big is this species?

Linke & Staeck (1997) introduce a species, called A. sp. "Maniapure". If I look at the pictures in Koslowskis book, I think, it's quite more similar to this than A. cf. pertensis/meinkeni.
But I do not know anything about this species, wether they are imported often or not and I never saw living specimen.

...so just a guess. Any comments?

greetings,
Rolo

 

[Melvin_Lim]

errr... got an id on the "female"... think it's a male gibbicep.

as for the 1st apisto, looks most likely to be meinkeni

anyway, another 2 pics

meinkeni? :

http://img50.photobucket.com/albums/v154/elimmel/Apistos/unknown4.jpg

male gibbicep :

http://img50.photobucket.com/albums/v154/elimmel/Apistos/unknown_female2.jpg

thanks for all the info

cheers
melvin

 

[Mike Wise]

I have had A. inornata (= A. sp. Maniapure, & A. sp. Piacoa in the USA) in the past. The fish in question is not A. inornata. A. inornata has a less distinctly bordered caudal spot, which extends into the tail fin. The fish pictured here has a well defined roundish spot that remains on the caudal peduncle, more like that on A. cf. pertensis. A. inornata is not collected commercially that I know about. My stock came from a hobbyist who collected them about 5 years ago near Piacoa, Venezuela. I'm not positive that the fish pictured is A. cf. pertensis, but this is more likely because it is commerically collected throughout the lower Amazon.

Mike Wise

 

[Rolo]

Hi Mike,

*oops* .. sorry for ignoring Staecks new description of A. inornata... my fault. (...new description - old brain )

I agree, that it is no A. inornata, especially because of the caudal spot. Unfortunately this couldn't be seen well in the first picture.

greetings,
Rolo