Large amazon biotope

[Pink Punisher]

Hey there everyone! I recently picked up a 96"x18"x15" aquarium and I was thinking of making an amazon biotope out of it. I know I want to incorporate tetras into so it needs to be fairly peaceful.

For filtration I was thinking of using three or four Rena XP2's and for heating I was thinking one or two Hydor inline heaters (recommended wattage?)

Lighting I was thinking two 6700K 4' t5 bulbs and maybe two 4' t5 actinic bulbs? If not actinic then what would suggest? I figured actinic would really make the colours pop on the fish but I could be wrong

Planting I've been debating about for a while, I'm think if its gonna be planted it will be very sparingly. Like for example some mosses and maybe a floating plant.

Now here comes the real problem, stocking! I've got two ideas floating around in my head and I'll post both lists. You'll have to excuse how.. messy they are as I can't decide what I like the most!

So here it is;

Stocking list idea

9x Adolfo's Cory (Corydoras adolfoi)
OR
9x Panda Cory (Corydoras panda)
OR
9x Tucan Cory (Corydoras tukano)

6 Apistogramma nijsseni
OR
6 Apistogramma gossei
OR
6 Apistogramma bitaeniata
OR
6 Apistogramma steindachneri
OR
6 Apistogramma pandurini
OR
6 Apistogramma baenschi "Inka"

2 Flash Pleco (L204) (Panaque sp.)

3 Whiptail/Twig Catfish (Farlowella acus)

15 Black Neon Tetra (Hyphessobrycon herbertaxelrodi)
OR
15 Bleher's Rummynose Tetra (Hemigrammus bleheri)

20 Cardinal Tetra (Paracheirodon axelrodi)

15 Emperor Tetra (Nematobrycon palmeri)
OR
15 Ulrey's Tetra (Hemigrammus ulreyi)

If you can't tell I like the look of yellow apisto's :biggrin:

So I'm mainly looking for opinions, recommendations, etc on what I can stock the tank with. Also If there are any problems with what I listed above for filration, heating, etc.

Cheers,

Spencer

 

[Pink Punisher]

I updated my stock idea, let me know what you guys think

9x Panda Cory (Corydoras panda)
OR
9x Tucan Cory (Corydoras tukano)

8 Apistogramma pandurini
OR
8 Apistogramma baenschi "Inka" (probably these guys!)

2 Flash Pleco (L204) (Panaque sp.)

3 Whiptail/Twig Catfish (Farlowella acus)

15 Bleher's Rummynose Tetra (Hemigrammus bleheri)

20 Cardinal Tetra (Paracheirodon axelrodi)

15 Ulrey's Tetra (Hemigrammus ulreyi)

10 Three-Lined Pencilfish (Nannostomus trifasciatus)

Cheers,

Spencer

 

[Bilbo]

Firstly that sounds like a great tank and should look fantastic, second I am jealous of the options and availability of the species you have.

I think you will make a great choice what ever you decide because you have put up a really good list.
My votes are...
The cory’s is a hard one because I like all of those but probably the Adolfo's from those. I actually like the sterbai or julii.
Apistos, I will always vote for bitaeniata as my number one all time favourite but like baenschi as well.

Tetras, I would go for the emperor just because I like them but as a schooling fish they aren’t that great, for pure visual effect then rummynoses do look pretty cool and would be a good contrast.

Of all the fish you have up the only one I definitely wouldn’t like, would be the black neon.

Can’t wait to see it up and running.

 

[Pink Punisher]

To be quite honest with you I don't even think I'll be getting the majority of the fish from local places. More likely I'll be ordering them from importers, almost positive for the Apistos at least.

I agree, the black neons wouldn't work so thats why I took them out. For the Apistos I mainly just want the most yellow I can get from breeding female and baenschi "Inka" seem to be the ones. I haven't been able to look into it with great depth yet though so I could be way off.

I was actually told on another forum that the Emperor are a bad choice because they like to stay at the bottom and the Apistos would just beat them for food everytime Not to mention though the Ulrey's tetras look better anyways :biggrin:

One more thing, is two rena xp2's enough filtration or should I look into getting a third or fourth?

Cheers,

Spencer

 

[MonteSS]

That stocking is very light.

For tetras, I would get like 100+ of a single species.

A school of hatchetfish would go nice also.

Some wild Scalare Angels or Altums could also go in there.

If you are not keeping fry you could also go with a couple different shoals of cories.

I recently got wild scalare angels, wild inka 50, and wild bitaeniata shushupe from http://www.amazontropicalfishllc.com/. They are healthy, acclimated well and beautiful fish. He also has wild cories, plecos, and tetras from peru. Pretty much everything you need for the proper amazon biotope. Depends if you are going for a particular river or general Amazon theme.

Call Scott there to see what he has currently or has coming in. Great guy with lots of knowledge of that area

...Bill

 

[Pink Punisher]

I think for the tetras then I'll add like 20 more of each, 15 more pencil fish, and 10 or 15 Marbled Hachet fish just for a little more variety. I can always add more later on as well.

Do you guys think think L204 will harress the Apistos or will they be able to hold there own? I think having fry would be very cool but I'm not gonna try and breed them for fry at least. So if a fry lives here or there I'll just put it up for sale or something.

If I was to have a couple different shoals of corys would the Apistos still keep their breeding suits are even though the corys would eat all there babies? Like for example would they just lay some more kind of thing?

Oh and Bill, thank you for the link but I live in Canada so I really only have two people to order from unless I wanna pay close to $400 on getting fish into the country

Spencer

 

[Pink Punisher]

Alright so here is another update of the stock list, I was told on another site that it was stocked quite lightly and to add more characins. So I've added quite a few, what are you guys/girls opinion on it?

8 Apistogramma baenschi "Inka"

35 Bleher's Rummynose Tetra (Hemigrammus bleheri)

40 Cardinal Tetra (Paracheirodon axelrodi)

30 Ulrey's Tetra (Hemigrammus ulreyi)

25 Three-Lined Pencilfish (Nannostomus trifasciatus)

15 Marble Hatchet (Carnegiella strigata)

9x Panda Cory (Corydoras panda)

9x Julii Cory (Cordydoras julii)

3 Whiptail/Twig Catfish (Farlowella acus)

2 Flash Pleco (L204) (Panaque sp.)
OR
2 Ringlet Pleco (Panaque maccus)
OR
2 Bristlenose/Bushynose Plecos (Ancistrus spp.)

1 Spotted/Marbled Hoplo (Megalechis thoracata)

I also found quite an interesting site that is like a smart stock list, you pick the fish you want and the amount and it will compile all the info to give a general recommend pH, temp, etc definately worth checking out!

http://aqadvisor.com/

Spencer

 

[Mike Wise]

We're missing an important piece of information: what will the water values be?

 

[Pink Punisher]

I will be aiming for a pH of somewhere between 6 and 7, a temperature of 25 - 26C and a hardness of 5 to 12 dH. Is that good enough?

 

[Mike Wise]

Carbonate hardness dKH? Many of the fish on your list are blackwater species. Will it be a problem softening/acidfying the water for a 110g/420L tank?

 

[Pink Punisher]

Yes dKH, sorry I was in a rush. It shouldn't be a problem, I was going to add Indian almond leaves or dried oak to help lower my pH anyways.

I've been debating on making a blackwater tub now for a little while. I'd have it filled with peat moss or something to make it softer then use that water to use in water changes. Would a RO unit be a good investment for this kind of setup?

Cheers,
Spencer

 

[Pink Punisher]

Has any here ever tried to lower there pH with Sodium bisulfate? It is commonly used in pools to lower the pH. All it does is create a chemical reaction upon mixing with water causing Sulfuric acid to be produced and as you all know Sulfuric acid has a low pH. In short it lowers the pH quite easily. I've been thinking of using this to lower my pH and just keep it in a tub under the tank. This would allow me to have a low pH without the having to get a ton of tannins in the water. I haven't looked into how much it would cost but from Amazon it is about $35 for 15lbs of the stuff and I would imagine that would last me quite some time!

Spencer

 

[Mike Wise]

Bisulfate will lower the pH at the expense of increasing the electrical conductivity. I would try using peat, which might soften the water as well as lower the pH and not increase the conductivity very much. If your water is moderately hard and you need more than 20 gallons of soft water per week, then an R/O unit is a good investment. On the other hand, this is a community tank - not a breeding tank - so you might be able to get away with tap water, if it isn't especially hard.

 

[Apistomaster]

Panaque sp L204 gets rather large, looses it's pretty juvenile colors long before they are full grown and they eat their weight in wood every few days creating a lot of "saw dust". It is an unusual also in that it comes from rather hard water with a pH of about 8.0.
The smaller Panaque maccus does do not much of anything useful and hides all the time.
I would consider some Peckoltia sp L134. Very colorful and less shy than any similarly sized small Hypancistrus spp. They are primarily carnivorous and do well on frozen blood worms, earth worm sticks and most sinking staple tropical fish foods.

I would consider Sturisoma aureum. if you want something different. They are commonly imported and I raise them occasionally. They are pretty good algae eaters although algae is eaten incidental to their search for small aquatic insect larvae. They really need regular feedings of frozen blood worms and I also use earth worm sticks. They are one of the very few truly diurnal Loricariidae species which makes them good display fish.
A few common Ancistrus cf. cirhossus are good algae eaters and a school of Otocinclus is useful for slender leaves and for generally interesting group behavior.

Choice of Corydoras is very optional. If you are intending to use very soft water then C. adolphi are a good choice and are very attractive. They do not thrive in most areas with hard and alkaline tap water. The other listed Corydoras are less demanding.

If you lean towards Apistogramma panduro or A. baenschi they too do best in very soft slightly acid water. A. nissenji has among the most beautiful females when they are in spawning colors. That is when all Apistogramma females turn yellow. Many species are only yellow when spawning.

Rummy Nose in a large school in soft water can really glow. I would also keep a group of one species of Pencilfish and one school of Hatchetfish.

If you want the Apistogramma species to be visible much it would be best not to add any wild Angelfish. Definitely not Altum Angels. They are from the Orinoco not the Amazonian Basin and all Angels grow large enough to disturb the smaller species. Apistogramma tend to live along the bottom. I find that in a large tank having a group of another pretty dwarf Cichlid, Dicrossus filamentosus, Lyretail Checker Boards make nice additions. They tend to live more among the midwater plants in the lower half of the water column. Unlike Apistogramma these spawn in the open on a small leaf.
If you seriously want to see your simulated Amazonian biotope fish at their best you need more than peat filtration. You need to use mostly RO water with just enough tap water mixed in to elevate the kH to about 4*.
That is soft but not so low in buffering capacity to cause the pH to crash easily. It should be easy to stabilize the pH at 6.0 to 6.4 by doing little or using peat in a filter or Cattapa leaves as litter. The latter two are optional and tint your water.