1. Hello guest! Are you an Apistogramma enthusiast? If so we invite you to join our community and see what it has to offer. Our site is specifically designed for you and it's a great place for Apisto enthusiasts to meet online. Once you join you'll be able to post messages, upload pictures of your fish and tanks and have a great time with other Apisto enthusiasts. Sign up today!

Apisto ID?? Sold as Trifasciata 'Maciliensis' (Again!)

Discussion in 'South American Cichlid Identification' started by Big G, May 16, 2011.

  1. Big G

    Big G New Member 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2009
    Messages:
    53
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Hi Guys,

    Well, I bought the little beauties below (only male pictured), and was sold it as Ap. Trifasciata 'Maciliensis', as seems to be the favourite trade name nowadays.

    Now after reading several threads here, I realise that Tri. Maciliensis effectively does not exist, and so is incorrectly labelled.

    So, that brings me to my question.... What is this Apisto?

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    I am thinking Trifasciata, but just want see what you guys in the know think?

    Sorry its not an exciting 'wild caught' specimen, but just a boring tank bred variant. I would only dream of being able to capture such fish!

    Thanks for any help, and your time.

    Regards
    Big G!
  2. jose_vogel

    jose_vogel Member 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2005
    Messages:
    317
    Likes Received:
    2
    Trophy Points:
    18
    He is a ver beautiful A. trifasciata.

    Reminds me as the ones which could be caught in the northerm extreme of Argentina (near the limit with Paraguay), it's slighty different (in the coloration of the dorsal fin and operculum) of the ones caught 500 km to the south.
  3. Big G

    Big G New Member 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2009
    Messages:
    53
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Thanks Jose.

    I'm rather pleased with how quickly this Male has coloured up and settled in! He was pure metallic blue with no black markings and no other colouration when he arrived in the petshop, but still he looked stunning. Now he's got that Red tinge across his Dorsal, he really looks fantastic! The Pics don't do him justice.

    So, since it appears he is a Trifasciata, I am correct that they do best in a Harem? I only have one tiny female at the moment, as thats all they had, but I'll try and get a few more if so?

    Regards
    G!
  4. Mike Wise

    Mike Wise Moderator Staff Member 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    9,814
    Likes Received:
    1,328
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I agree with Jose. The form that usually was sold as 'A. maciliensis' was A. cf. trifasciata (Guaporé) from the Rio Guaporé of Bolivia. This form has a honey color above the lateral band, not the metallic blue color. A. trifasciata does best in a harem situation, but I have bred them as pairs in the past. In those situations, the males become very pushy.
  5. Big G

    Big G New Member 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2009
    Messages:
    53
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Thanks Mike,

    I have noticed that the Male has chased the female around the tank (quite assertively at times) a fair bit in the past day (only go them yesterday morning), almost as if he's trying to shepherd her into the plant pot! He always stops chasing her when he reaches the mouth of the pot. Then a few minutes later he does the same!

    The female is a very small 1.5cm at the moment, so I'm hoping that she is indeed a female! She does have the black leading edge to the Dorsal, so I think it is a she, and not an un matured male. Time wil tell!? I'd get a pic, but she keeps hiding in some moss so the male can't chase her!

    So, just to be clear, this is not the cf. Trifasciata (Guapore), but is rather just plain Ap. Trifasciata, possibly originating from Northern Argentina? The honey colouration seems to be spreading a little more, but is mainly localised to the top of the head, and just behind the gills. It does not extend all the way over the top of the back.

    Regards
    G!
  6. Mike Wise

    Mike Wise Moderator Staff Member 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    9,814
    Likes Received:
    1,328
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Remember that it is the female who initiates breeding. If she is not ready, the male will often try to drive her out of his territory. He hopes another female who wants to breed will enter his territory. This is why it is best to have 2 or more females (if possible) with polygamous males. I do not see any honey yellow color in your photos. If it is there, then it is possible that your fish are from the Rio Guaporé system. The amount of yellow varies. On some fish it is mostly on the head; on others it extends onto the flanks above the lateral band.
  7. Big G

    Big G New Member 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2009
    Messages:
    53
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    In the first picture the honey colouration is slightly visible on the top of the head, and running along the dorsal ridge, but he has coloured up more so since that picture. The honey colour is definately localised to the top of his head to just past the gills, although his flanks are still clear of honey, and very metallic blue.

    I'll try and get a better shot, but he keeps away from the front of the tank, which is why the pic is a little unclear. I took these shots on very awkward angles down the side of the tank!

    Thanks again for your time!

    Regards
    G!
  8. Big G

    Big G New Member 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2009
    Messages:
    53
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Ok, I managed to get two more females from a different Fish shop, but the male became very aggitated, and eventually managed to kill one of the new females. Should I take him out of this tank, and allow the remaining two females to settle in first, before re-introducing him?

    I always thought that Trifasciata were a passive species, but seing how aggressive this male has been with the females, I'm quite simply stunned!

    Currently they are in a smaller tank, whilst I prepare a 1.2m (4ft) planted tank for them, but it would seem that there is no place to hide for the females? Even the plant pots he'll duck into and chase them out or trap them in. He seems to do a frantic tail slapping dance for a minute or so, before he finally moves in and rams them at quite some speed! Sometimes the females move in time, but sometimes not! Whilst the females seem to be managing to hide for a short while, he eventually finds them, and the pursuit begins again! I'm concerned he's going to kill those ones too!

    Regards
    G!
  9. Mike Wise

    Mike Wise Moderator Staff Member 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    9,814
    Likes Received:
    1,328
    Trophy Points:
    113
    A. trifasciata is fairly aggressive for its small size. Did you rearrange the decor before adding the new fish? This is something one should always do when adding new fish to fish with already established territories. It seems that your male is ready to breed but the females are not. He will try to drive them out of his territory (the tank) in hopes that a willing female will arrive. It is also important that each female has a territory of her own, with established boundaries. This mean breaking up any line-of-sight across much of the tank. I find territorial aggression among females more lethal than between males and females.
  10. Apistomaster

    Apistomaster Member 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    May 8, 2006
    Messages:
    644
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Temporarily removing the male will often allow the females to establish discrete territories. Return the male in five to seven days and you will put him in the position of having to establish his dominance again but on more equal terms.
  11. Big G

    Big G New Member 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2009
    Messages:
    53
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    THings have settled down quite nicely now! One of the females spawned, although that spawn did not seem to get properly fertilised, or at least all the eggs calcified, but as a result, the male has calmed down nicely!

    The 'yellow' female is keepin him in check, so he only occasionally chases the other female, but never the 'breeding' one! She looks like she should be ready to lay again in the next few days, so we'll see how that goes? Its quite funny seeing this massive (compared to both females) male being all subservient! I think I even saw him fetching the breeding females slippers the other night! Hehe!

    Seriously though, its nice to see things calm down a lot, and to see that they may actually have some viable spawns in the future? Time will tell I guess?

    Thanks again for everyones help!
    Regards
    G!