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A. Hongsloi cannot close mouth....looks like food is stuck in his mouth

papasmurf

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but that is not the problem. I have seen something near identical with one or two of my other apisto's over the past year and they usually stop eating, lose color, before dying after a week or two. Oddly enough it seems to have happened more to the Hongsloi's than the other species. The currently affected fish is lethargic but not breathing heavy (at least yet). It almost looks like a dislocated jar or if he had tried to swallow a large piece of food and damaged his jaw but I 99% sure that is not the problem as I feed them mainly live food, flake, and really small pellets. Any ideas what could be wrong and what the appropriate treatment might be?
 

Mike Wise

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Jaws locked open on apistos, although unusual, is not rare either. Sadly, there's not much you can do about it. Some hobbyists have tried to force the mouth closed only to break the jaws. Sometimes (rarely) the jaws return to normal. It the fish can't do this and starts to starve it is best to euthanize it.
 

gerald

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I have seen jaw paralysis too, sometimes accompanied by paralysis of pectoral fin. It may be associated with internal bacterial infections, but there could be other causes. Recovery is rare, in my experience.
 

papasmurf

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The male hongsloi did eventually pass....no problems since then until this evening when I noticed my largest baenschi male sitting on the bottom and generally lethargic. He is not breathing hard, not swollen, has no feces, or anything else to indicate something is wrong other than apathy and he did not seem interested in food and the female is trying to spawn with him and he is not interested. I have a feeling this is just the beginning of the same problems I have encountered over and over again. Is there something in particular to try treating the tank with to kick this cycle? I have not had any issues with several fish coming down with the same symptoms at onces...it is usually spread out a few months apart. I do WC's (RO with RO right) very frequently and the tank the fish are in is heavily planted. The fish eat pellets, flake, whiteworms, blackworms, and frozen BS and BW's. I have another tank with apisto's and for the most part, have not had near the issues with fish wasting away as the other tank. I do not think the fish are dying of old age as most of them are probably 2 years old at the most.
 

Mike Wise

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Hmm. Seems like a problem with this particular tank and apistos. If it were my tank I'd 'break it down' and start over new. Only you can decide if this works for you. I'd also consider having a dedicated quarantine tank, if you don't have one.
 

papasmurf

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I picked up some Kanamycin (kanaplex) just to see if he could be saved. His lips kind of look swollen and his mouth is open but not quite the same way the hongsloi was...the baenschi seems to have a large mouth anyways. The fish is a bit more active than it was previously and I did notice a slight amount of healthy poop coming from him so hopefully this is having some positive results. I am going to follow up with another dose and see how things go.
 

papasmurf

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The Kanamycin seemed to help for a while. I dosed several times and the fish seemed to regain some energy and normality only to have the same issue a week or two later. I moved him to another tank to isolate him and try treating again but he passed. I noticed another smaller baenschi male today with something wrong with his mouth as well and a male kelleri that has grown lethargic suddenly and is perhaps a bit swollen. None of the other (non apisto) fish seem to have issues (tetra's, pleco's, pencil's, cories). I have lost one tetra in about the last two years and that is it. At this point I am going to treat the tank again and just wait it out whatever that is. It may just have to be a non-apisto tank from this point on as for whatever reason, I cannot get them to survive long term in this tank.
 

dw1305

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Hi all,
A bit of a long shot, but might it be a thyroid tumour (hyperplasia)? It will affect the rear of the mouth and gills, and is caused by iodine deficiency. I've had a couple of Pencil fish develop it, and I successfully treated the second one with potassium iodide (KI) and Iodine.

Details are here <"https://en.wikivet.net/Goitre_-_Fish">

jod.jpg


cheers Darrel
 

papasmurf

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It is actually right above the lips that looks abnormal....not like in the photo you posted. It looks kind of like the fish has food in it mouth and sometimes I can see a reddish area above the lips under the skin but it is not food and the condition seems to be there until the fish succumbs.
 

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