Nannostomus Sp.'Cenepa/Amaya'

[SpotOn88]

I'll start by saying that I've kept many pencils over the years (all of the more common types + some less so such as N.Harrisoni & N.Espei) and I've never had the difficulties I've had with Nannostomus Sp 'Cenepa' & Nannostomus Sp 'Amaya'.

Within the past 12 months I've had groups of 20 of each with good M/F ratios and what I believed would be suitable conditions for them (pH 6.2, dGh 4, tds 150ppm, 26/27 degrees c with no nitrite or ammonia). Biotope type set up (driftwood heavy, sand bottom, plenty of floating plants to diffuse light & provide shelter), regular W/Cs.

Despite all of this, I have continued to lose them one by one every now and again with no obvious cause of death. I'm now left with a handful of each...

I should also add that these have been kept with species such as Biotoecus Opercularis, Ivanacara Bimaculata, Corys, other tetras etc and I have not lost any other fish during the same time frame.

They were purchased in various different batches from 2 x LFS that I trust so that makes me rule out it just being one bad batch. Although I appreciate they may have been all from the same import (I'm in the UK).

I'm at a loss and would appreciate any suggestions as to what could be causing this or whether it's something I'm not providing etc.

There are a lovely looking fish but do cost a pretty penny and my experience so far would make me hesistate to get any more in the near future.

 

[dw1305]

Hi all,

They were purchased in various different batches from 2 x LFS that I trust so that makes me rule out it just being one bad batch. Although I appreciate they may have been all from the same import (I'm in the UK).

I'm at a loss and would appreciate any suggestions as to what could be causing this or whether it's something I'm not providing etc.

This has always happened to me with <"Pencil fish and allies">, I think the problem is that they really don't like one another and, even if they don't physically damage one another, stress does for them over time.

cheers Darrel

 

[SpotOn88]

Hi all,

This has always happened to me with <"Pencil fish and allies">, I think the problem is that they really don't like one another and, even if they don't physically damage one another, stress does for them over time.

cheers Darrel

A fair point & something I've heard before.

It's strange though how the other pencils I've also currently got at the moment (N.Eques, N.Marilynae & N.Rubrocaudatus) haven't had any similar issues.

I'm of the opinion that as stunning as these particular species are there is ultimately something that I can't recreate/provide in my tank for them for them to thrive.

 

[MacZ]

Also don't forget, they usually only reach a short lifespan. 2-3 years on average, which means many don't reach a full year and few mak it past 1.5 years. Depending on the age at purchase it is very possible that the stress factor does them in as well.

 

[Mike Wise]

These species do have a reputation for being more aggressive - especially the males - compared to other more common pencilfish.

 

[SpotOn88]

These species do have a reputation for being more aggressive - especially the males - compared to other more common pencilfish.

This is not necessarily what I observed.

I saw an undisputed alpha establish himself who, almost like a dwarf cichlid, had his little area in the tank. The rest of the males fell in line and whilst there was the occasional flaring there was nothing that concerned me.

I'm fortunate enough to be able to work from home a few days p/w when I'm not required in the office so I've been able to observe their behavior.

Also don't forget, they usually only reach a short lifespan. 2-3 years on average, which means many don't reach a full year and few mak it past 1.5 years. Depending on the age at purchase it is very possible that the stress factor does them in as well.

Another good point.

Appreciate the input from everyone.

 

[KenL]

I’ve only seen these once (a few months ago) in a great shop in Livingston, Scotland.

They were stunning fish, but I was really shocked by the price. I think about £50 each.
I just wouldn’t risk paying that for such a small fish.

 

[SpotOn88]

I’ve only seen these once (a few months ago) in a great shop in Livingston, Scotland.

They were stunning fish, but I was really shocked by the price. I think about £50 each.
I just wouldn’t risk paying that for such a small fish.

I believe that was the price they were when they first started coming into the UK... however over the past 12 months I've seen most places mark up around £20 - £25.

I paid closer to £22 per fish and considering my preference to keep them in larger groups (20+) they are not cheap. Still, we live & learn.

 

[NicoHKnol]

I ave a tank with about 30 nannostmus mortenthaleri. Keeping them for about three years now. The problems described are familiar. So i would like to say two things;
First the batches sold with he species Nannostomus Sp 'Cenepa' & Nannostomus Sp 'Amaya'. Are 99% males. So territorials behaviour will be stronger and with finding no mates to spawn makes it worse. Females are rarely sold, main reasons, no market and the collectors cannot see the differences.
Second is a feeding problem. My nannostomus are fed with very small frozen food. Cyclops multiple times a week. Artemia or nano mix food 1 times a week. Grains also 1 time in the week. One day iin the week rest, no feeding.
I keep them in a 200 litre tank with a group of 8 apistogramma baenchi inca and a school of 12+ corydoras golden stripe peru. Every fish from the wild. Ph 6.0, Gh 3, Kh 2 uS about 90.

 

[A Timbers Fan]

I had 4x of these fish in a 20 gallon long. Eventually I had 3, and I suspect aggression/stress was the cause as already noted. However, I very quickly lost all 3 remaining fish when I turned the temperature to 80 degrees Fahrenheit to trigger my Taeniacara candidi to spawn (it worked!) I suspect these Pencils don't like the heat.

Stress, aggression, and lifespan may also play a role. I have a group of N. marginatus that I lose 1 every 5 months - it bloats rather quickly and dies within a few days. Bacterial? Maybe, but no other fish experience similar.

 

[SpotOn88]

I had 4x of these fish in a 20 gallon long. Eventually I had 3, and I suspect aggression/stress was the cause as already noted. However, I very quickly lost all 3 remaining fish when I turned the temperature to 80 degrees Fahrenheit to trigger my Taeniacara candidi to spawn (it worked!) I suspect these Pencils don't like the heat.

Stress, aggression, and lifespan may also play a role. I have a group of N. marginatus that I lose 1 every 5 months - it bloats rather quickly and dies within a few days. Bacterial? Maybe, but no other fish experience similar.

I've also had similar with losing N.Marginatus randomly and bloat appeared to be the main symptom.

It's a shame as pencils are one of my personal favourites and my go to dithers for my dwarfs.

 

[A Timbers Fan]

I've also had similar with losing N.Marginatus randomly and bloat appeared to be the main symptom.

It's a shame as pencils are one of my personal favourites and my go to dithers for my dwarfs.

I must admit I feel better knowing you have similar issues with them. Mine are 1.5 years old (from the store) so are likely 2 years old at least.