Dying Of Old Age Or Bacteria Problem.

[Andrew C]

I had a pair of A. Nijenssi in a 10G tank for 4 months, who got on well, as there was not much fighting.
The water parameters were: PH -7.1, KH - 3, GH - 2, AMM - 0, NITITE - 0, NITRATE - less than 5 (Aquarium Pharmaceutical test kit).
It was filtered by a powerhead with a sponge fitted to it, the powerhead also has an air valve on it to let it pump bubbles into the tank as well.
I did 30% water changes weekly and was feeding them three times a day with frozen food.
I also tried Kent Blackwater Extract for a couple of months, but stopped using it as i thought it wasn't doing anything to encorage the fish to breed.

A month ago i noticed that the male was not eating and hiding away, which was unsual.
I moved his pot and saw that he had lost all his colour, no signs of parasites, stringy poo, or disease, just very pale and not eating.
I waited to see what would happen as the female was still eating and full of colour, and sure enough, the next day his colour was back and he was eating again.

A week later, when i went to feed them after work, i found the male dead, and the female was now showing a loss of colour and not eating, but the next day she was fine again.
I thought i had bought an old pair of fish and the loss of colour was a sign of this.
So i moved the female into my Cory tank (30G with some Peppers & Pandas), to let her live her days out.
I moved a pair of Cacatuoides into the 10G and they are still healthy (couple of weeks now in the tank).

The female has been showing loss of colour on and off for a couple of weeks, and spends a lot of time in her clay pot, usually eats something each day, and when she dose come out for a swim, she hangs near the surface of the water above the filter inlet, i guess to avoid the current.

It wasn't until i was speaking to a LFS owner about it, he said it didn't sound like old age, more like a bacteria build up in the tank.

Did the male die of old age, or could it be a bacteria build up ?

Hope you can help,
Andrew.

 

[aspen]

i would suspect it succumbed to a disease. have you seen the fish eat, and it's feces?

rick

 

[Randall]

Sick A. nijsenni

Dear Andrew,

From your description, it doesn't sound like your apistos are/were suffering from old age. Perhaps, some patheogen is responsible here.

The lethergy and loss of color is consistent with intestinal protazoa, but that is accompanied by long, stringy and pale feces.

I don't know how much current your powerhead is causing, but apistos are not rheophilic fish. If the current is/was extreme, it is possible that your fish eventually became ill due to compromised immune systems.

For the record, I've never had any success housing apisto pairs in 10-gallon aquaria, despite weekly 50% water changes. Oddly, though, others surely have.

For breeding A. nijsenni, your water values appear too hard and alkaline. The Nijsenni Complex cichlids, as a rule, do best in soft, acidic water (KH: 1-2; pH: 5.5ish, but no higher than 6.0) and are, unfortunately, prone to bacterial infections. For this reason, one need be very careful about water quality.

All the best,

Randall Kohn

 

[Andrew C]

Thanks for the replies Aspen & Randall.

The puzziling thing is, they do not have long trailing poo, it goes to about an inch long and then drops off within a minute.
Is there anything i can do for "Intestinal Protazoa", as i can set up a hospital tank.
I live in the UK and cannot buy anti-biotics from a shop, only basic treatments from a LFS.

Reguarding the current, i will turn it down to its minimum (Interpet PH2's, if you have heard of them, as they have two flow settings).
I will also increase the water changes in the Apisto tanks to 50% each week.

I have four pairs of Apistos in the same set up as the Nijennsi were, can you please tell me the ideal water conditions for breeding them.
A pair of Viejta's in a 20G Long tank (it was meant to be a grow out tank, but it is the only tank where the female has stopped knocking the living daylights out of the male).
And three 10G tanks with pairs of: A. Cacutoides / A. Cacutoides / A. Trifiscata.

Thanks
Andrew.

 

[Randall]

Breeding Apistos

Dear Andrew,

Glad to hear that you're planning on increasing your water changes to 50% per week. It can only help.

The preferred medication for intestinal protozoa is the same for fish as it is for humans: Metronidazole. I don't know what propriety brands are available to you in the UK, but Aquarium Pharmacuticals makes a product called "Hex-a-Mit" that contains Metronidazole.

As for breeding your apisto pairs, I'd recommend the following approximate water parameters. Please know that these are not etched in stone and, in many cases, water quality can be more important than water chemistry. Soft, acidic water can be achieved through using an R/O unit, conditioning with peat moss, or both.

A. cacatuoides - Moderately soft to moderately hard tap water is fine.
A. viejita - Soft, acidic water: KH 2-3; pH 6.0-6.5
A. trifasciata - Same as A. viejita
A. nijsenni - Soft acidic water: KH 1-2; pH 5.50ish (no higher than 6.0)

Temperature for all the above species at 78 degrees F.

Good luck to you Andrew.

All the best,

Randall Kohn

 

[dhm325]

What are the syptoms of old age in a fish? One of my male p. pulchers has stopped eating and seems to be slowly wasting away. There are no signs of paracitic or other infection that I can see. No stringy poop or loss of color in this fish or any other in the tank. In fact he is actively raising a brood of about 100 1 month old fry with his mate. He actively swims around the tank and chases the dither fish. But he hasn't eaten for over a week and is beginning to look like a skeleton. I bought this fish as an adult from an lfs about six months ago. He has long filiments on his fins and I think he was fully mature when I bought him.

 

[Neil]

First of all, I have to say that Randall statement-

water quality can be more important than water chemistry.

is the key to working with all Dwarf Cichlids! Know that first and then fool with the water parms and you will succeed more often than not.
Personally, I have found that trifasciata, cacatuoides, and nijsenni can be spawned in relatively neutral water (with better results coming from softer, more acidic water), but viejita has often required me to drop the pH below 6, with little hardness, to get viable spawns.

What are the syptoms of old age in a fish?

A good answer to this would be "he hasn't eaten for over a week and is beginning to look like a skeleton." If you bought him as an adult and he is doing his duty, but fading 6 months later, I would say that there is a good chance that old age is setting in. Many times old age will be a precursor to secondary problems that inevitably cause the death of the fish, but sometimes they are fairly healthy and just die from old age. It is kind of the same for us. I would say that is a good life lived. Hats off to you and your pulcher!
Neil

 

[Andrew C]

Thanks for the replies.

Just now i will concentrate more on Water Quality than Chemistry.

The female Nijennsi is showing a bit more colour just now and swimming about more.
Will check the LFS at the weekend.

Thanks,
Andrew.