Algae coming back, what could I be doing wrong

[Glasgowa]

Hello all

I have a 220 litre tank which I started in February this year. Since about June/July or so it was overcome with algae (see below)

I was using liquid ferts (API) and had an air stone going and was advised to stop both. I then introduced co2 (hydror natural yeast system) which probably doesn't produce enough for the size of tank. Anyway 90% of the algae cleared up within 3-4 weeksbut over the last 4 days I am noticing that it's coming back. I have ordered 2 SAE's to give that a try but was wondering if there is anything obvious I am doing wrong.
My tank stock is:
4 Cleithracara Maronii
6 Mikrogeophagus Altispinosus
1 Otocinclus Flexilis
3 Otocinclus Arnoldi
13 Paracheirodon axelrodi
1 Nannostomus unifasciatus/eques (diptail)
3 Panaque Maccus
1 Corydoras julii

Any help would be appreciated
Andrew

(picture taken before angels taken out)

 

[Glasgowa]

Tried to edit my last post but it didn't like it.

My parameters are:

PH 6.5
Temp 26.5
Nitrates 5
Nitrites 0
Ammonia 0

I use an Eheim 2026 external filter.
Lighting 2 x 30 watt Arcadia Original Tropical

Cheers

Andrew

 

[beleg]

Get a few Siamese Algae Eaters, 2 you ordered may not be enough for a 220 liter but better than none.. If you start to add CO2 you should start to add the nutrients , i.e the fertilizer back again. Algae thrive only if the plants lack some form of nutrients (light,CO2, ferts.). They are very adept as assimilating excess nutrients where plants are adept when all types of nutrients are found. Turning of lights during noon time for about an hour is said to help fight the algae .. I haven't tested this myself but is said to work well. Hope this helps.

 

[ed seeley]

Beleg's spot on with the nutrients issue. And the SAEs too, I've three and they squabble with each other. I'd say one or three at least from a behaviour point of view.

It looks like you've got some Cladophora and Black Brush algae. BBA is apparently linked to low, or fluctutating, CO2 levels.

Looking at your tank you don't seem to have any fast growing stem plants in there. While you might not want any long term you need some plants that will grow quickly to use up the nutrients from the fish and and their heavy growth seems to help with the algae. As you're lighting's pretty low (I reckon you have about 55 gallons of water and only 60W of light) about 1 watt per gallon you might want to try something like Hygrophila polysperma as I found this would grow in almost any light. But everything in your tank would grow better if you could get the light closer to 2WPG - you won't believe how much your swords will love the extra light and some more nutrients!

The siesta method with lights is said to work by some, but I ran it for a year or so and I'm not convinced. It is thought that it may work by allowing the CO2 levels to rise in the tank as the lights are off and then the plants can photosynthesize better when the lights go back on. If you're adding enough CO2 this shouldn't be an issue. Also many swords don't do as well under short day conditions and won't grow as well, or flower, under this regime.

In this order I'd up your water changes (removing as much algae as possible each time), add your SAEs, add some fast growing stem plants, add more CO2 (you could do this by getting a pop bottle and putting a DIY CO2 mix in there, http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/do-yourself-aquarium-projects/14453-diy-co2-guide-pictures-recipes.html, and then connecting that to your other CO2 kit and diffuser) and finally look at getting a bit more light (T5 power compact bulbs are really good for this as you can fit a lot of power in a small area in the hood).

Good luck! :biggrin:

 

[Glasgowa]

Beleg and Ed

Thanks for your advice. I will start introducing ferts straight away. I will be getting my 2 SAE's from Tri-mar tomorrow (all ready ordered so can't up the order) and will try to introduce more co2 (the hydror system is basically a posh pop bottle so should be able to join one in). Certainly the tank, at the moment, is nothing like the first 2 pictures but just don't want it to get that bad again.

As from tomorrow my stocking will be the following, is this amountof fish ok for the size/volume of tank (100cm x 40cm x 45cm 220 lires):
4 Cleithracara Maronii
6 Mikrogeophagus Altispinosus
1 Otocinclus Flexilis
3 Otocinclus Arnoldi
13 Paracheirodon axelrodi
5 Nannostomus unifasciatus/eques (diptail)
2 Crossocheilus siamensis
3 Panaque Maccus
1 Corydoras julii

Thanks

Andrew

 

[beleg]

That is a little too much maybe. Have you ever tested your NO3 amount? Eds suggestion with H.polysperma and increased water changes is a very good idea if you got high NO3 amounts.

 

[Glasgowa]

Beleg

My NO3 (nitrate) is 5 and have never been higher so don't think thats a problem. Will hold off the other CO2 system and try the Hygrophila polysperma, water changes and SAE's for now.

Cheers

Andrew

 

[ed seeley]

Do bear in mind that a lot of test kits are pretty inaccurate really and can only be used as a rough guide unless you've calibrated them against known concentrations. When a magazine (PFK) were testing kits some didn't register quite major changes in levels.
http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.uk/pfk/pages/show_article.php?article_id=116

I noticed the angels weren't listed on your stocking. Are they still in there too?

 

[spine]

Glasgowa,
Try water changes of 40-50 % a week (this will help prevent a build up of ferts) and as the others have said, add more light and CO2. I use a product by Seachem called Flourish excel. Excel is basicly a organic carbon. I have (overdosed) with excel to kill algae. I have done this without killing fish(warning) , dont go crazy with it or you will. I add Excel at the recommended dose for an initial use and then double the regular recommended dose every other day after that until the algae goes away.

You have to have the right balance of fertilizer for the plants to thrive(wich=less algae) you also need good water circulation within the tank so that the fertilizer can utilized by the plants . I would keep your lights on for 8-10 hours a day and no longer(a timer helps). Deficiencies in ferts,trace elements and CO2 aid in algae growth so you want to keep all of these in the correct range and constant. I keep my N (nitrate) P (phosphate) K (potassium) levels at a ratio of 10:1:10 Its worked pretty well for me.
You will need to develop a manual or automated system to maintain these levels I recommend using this calculator http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/forumapc/fertilator.php

Aquatic Plant Central also has a great forum with plenty of DYI stuff and knowlegable people that can help you. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions

 

[Glasgowa]

Ed

I will check with a friends test kit and see if there is much difference.

The angels went back to my LFS last Sunday. The story was.....

I bought 2 very young blue acara's, which afer they grew up a bit turned out to be green terrors so took them back to my LFS. After they were taken out the angels started picking on the Keyholes and Bollivians so took the angels back and here I am with a more calmed down tank do miss the green terrors though, beautiful fish
Cheers
Andrew

 

[Glasgowa]

Spine

Thanks for the advice, I have heard about the flourish excel and might give it a go.

The 2 SAE have been put in today and I have ordered some fast growing plants. I Did my usual 25-30% water change today and put in some liquid ferts (API) so will see what happens over the next week.

Thanks

Andrew

 

[javoski]

I add Excel at the recommended dose for an initial use and then double the regular recommended dose every other day after that until the algae goes away.

I was able to control Black Brush algae using the Excel recommended dose. But I use a syringe to spray it directly into the algae.

Next day it´s red.

 

[deverne]

Hi all.

I, too, have had great success with the flourish line. Overdosing the excell needs to be done with caution, obviously. I have double dosed in a 125gal, and all of my val died back. It has grown out again, but it was a mess for a while! I have also had great success with a siesta period. My understanding is that plant photosynthesize almost immediately at light up, and algea need to "warm up" to get photosynthesising. So, when the lights go out for a couple of hours mid-day the algea has to start all over again.

I have a 46 gal that has 1 bushynose pleco for clean-up, I use flourish excell, along with flourish, flourish iron, and potassium WC 2x week, and siesta mid-day, and no algea. I have stopped the siesta on the 125, and use the same dosing and wc sched and have algea coming back.

Hope this is useful input.

DeVerne

 

[Glasgowa]

Thanks to all of you who took the time to pass on your advice. I have added more plants, including the fast growing one Ed mentioned. Got 2 SAE's which are doing a good (slow) job. Looks a lot better now although am still concidering the florish excell and more co2.

Cheers

Andrew

 

[ed seeley]

Glad something seems to be working. If the SAEs are too slow you might want to add a small group of Otocinclus too - they are great algae eaters and will eat different types to the SAEs. But IMO while it's getting better don't mess with anything, just keep doing what you're doing!

Your tank's really going to look great when those swords get a bit bigger and it all fills in.

 

[Glasgowa]

Ed

I have a group of 5 otto's so between them, the clown plecs and the SAE I should have no algae left at all!!

I must admit, can't wait till the swords grow a bit, the oldest ones are only 3-4 months old so now I need to leave the tank to mature a bit (easier said than done though)
Cheers

Andrew

 

[ed seeley]

Ed

I have a group of 5 otto's so between them, the clown plecs and the SAE I should have no algae left at all!!

Really should have looked back over your previous posts shouldn't I...