55G stocking options- SA dwarfs

[GoDSMiLe]

Hey All,
I am really interested in creating a South American dwarf cichlid tank, and this seems to be the perfect place to pose my problem. As of now, I don't really have any experience with dwarf cichlids, so I've been asking around a couple of forums trying to get a good feel for what my possibilities are. This seems like the most appropriate place yet

How would this work as a base to build the tank off of?

2 apistos (species depend on whats available and ur suggestions)
2 keyholes
2 angels
15 cardinal tetras
1 bristlenoses

The idea behind the tank is to safely include as many cichlid species as possible, as this will be in the entrance of my dorm next year. Hopefully, with their beautiful coloration and intelligent behavior I will be able to win my roommates over to the hobby. Any suggestions you can give to increase the amount of cichlids, balance out the tank, or whatever, please give. The stock of the tank is really just a blank canvas at this point.

A friend already suggested apistogramma sp. "fresa" as the apisto if I can find it. Would you agree, and how common are they? I will probably be buying them at The Aquarium Center in MD if anyone is familiar with the store.

Thanks for the help!
Mike

 

[GoDSMiLe]

32 views but no response. Would an admin be willing to move this topic to the SA dwarf cichlids section that I didn't see orignally, as it might get a better response (or any response at all) over there.

Thanks,
Mike

 

[farm41]

I have no experience with keyholes, but as far as commenting on which apisto, I would like to know what the water parameters are. Ph? Kh? EC?

 

[Fogelhund]

Are Cardinals not the diet of Angels in the wild?

 

[Randall]

South American Dwarf Cichlid Setup

Dear Mike,

How many cichlid species you can house in your new tank depends on the size of the tank and the chemistry of the water used within.

Many Apistogramma species are quite peaceful and can be housed with Cleithracara maronii well in a 55-gallon tank or larger. Both do best in a well-planted tank with soft water. C. maronii can be difficult to sex, especially when young, so you might want to get four. This way you are assured of having at least one male and one female.

Adding a couple of Ptererophyllum scalare could be problematic. This species grows to be larger, is considerably more aggressive than most Apistogramma spp. and Cleithracara maronii, and may out compete them for food. If you want to keep the former two, I wouldn't introduce the later.

Plecostomus types generally grow to be very large, are nocternal and have a way of eating eggs and larvae. It might be better to include an Ottocinclus spp. instead.

A shoal of smaller dither fish, like Paracheirodon axelrodi, is highly recommended. Their presence will make your dwarf cichlids feel more at home.

Good luck!

All the best,

Randall Kohn

 

[GoDSMiLe]

I would like to know what the water parameters are. Ph? Kh? EC?

Duh. I'm actually not going to set the tank up until fall semester next year, so of course I didn't think to check the water first. I'll make sure to do that soon. If my water does prove to be too hard or a pH about 7, I could/should lower it with peat, correct?

Are Cardinals not the diet of Angels in the wild?

As far as I've read (and my exerience has shown), angels don't eat cardinals. You might be confusing them with neons, which they do eat in the wild.

Adding a couple of Ptererophyllum scalare could be problematic.

I had no idea. I knew they were larger and alittle more aggressive, but I had no idea they might outcompete the apistos and maronii for food. Thanks for the advice, I might have made a big mistake otherwise.

Is there any type of SA dwarf cichlid that would occupy the midwater space, that is, not be a bottom dweller. I had originally considered the angels so there weren't as many cichlids occupying the bottom of the tank. Would you have any suggestions?

 

[Randall]

SA Dwarf Cichlid Setup

Dear Mark,

Most cichlids tend to occupy the bottom third of so of the water column. I've noticed that Cleithracara maronii, however, given their larger size, tend to utilize more of the tank.

Should your water be too hard, softening it with peat moss is a good idea.

Good luck!

Randall Kohn

 

[GoDSMiLe]

Thanks.

So for a "revised" stocking list, how does this look?

2 Cleithracara maronii (initially 4-5 until i get a pair)
2 Apistogramma cacatuoides (easy to find, pretty cheap, and pretty)
2 Apistogramma agassizii
6 Corydoras paleatus
8 Otocinclus affinis
15 Paracheirodon axelrodi

Too much? Still any bad combinations (I couldn't find the list of apisto complexes I had somewhere, don't want any chances of hybridization)? Should I add more individuals to any of the species? Would any other dwarfs fit in the tank, either as a beter replacement or in addition?


Thanks for all the help so far!
Mike

 

[Neil]

GoDSMiLe,

WELCOME TO THE FORUM

The combination is not that bad but you may be pressing your luck in the room that the 3 species of Cichlids decide that they need and want to push anyone else out of. Most definitely the list is good without the addition of the pair of aggies. The aggies are necessarily the issue; it is more the 3rd species. It is a little bit of a wild card, because it may work and it may not. You could give it a try and see how things go. Just be ready to remove one species, if there is too many problems.

You are fine with mixing groupings of fish. A somewhat safe method is to mix a thin-bodied species with a thick-bodied species. You have done that with aggies and cacs. No hybridization will occur.

Possibly a better bet than the aggies would be a pair of rams, Nannacara, Laetacara or Crenicara. But, again, you still have a little bit of a third species wild card.

Good luck,
Neil

 

[GoDSMiLe]

WELCOME TO THE FORUM

Thanks. I laugh everytime i see that for some reason. Ill try it with the rams then and keep my extra 15 open incase I have problems. Thanks for all the advice.

Mike

 

[strohl71]

GodSmile -

I keep 10 dwarfs in a 38 gallon tank along with 2 bristlenose plecos. The dwarfs include 1 ram, 1 keyhole and 8 different apistos (all different species). They generally all get along well. No serious fighting or chasing. No fish seems to defend a territory. There are some very minor scraps here and there, but hey, they are cichlids after all. The dwarfs ignore the plecos all together.

I do not know if I am lucky or if different species and sexes of dwarfs can always be housed together like this.

 

[GoDSMiLe]

Thank you very much for the insight you have provided. It must be a very beautiful tank with so many dwarf in there! Do you have any pictures?

Mike

 

[strohl71]

Sorry, I do not have any pics.

I will do my best to briefly describe though:

38 gal tank. Semi planted with plenty of rockwork for hiding / sleeping places.

My dwarfs consist of a Blue Ram (female?), a Keyhole (male?), A. agassizii (female), A. cacatuoides (2 males - 1 double red and 1 orange flash), A. nijsseni (female), A. sp. Steel Blue (male), A. sp. Opal (female) and A. hongsloi (female). Then there are also the 2 bushy-nose plecos.

As I stated in my earlier post, all the fish generally get along well. I have never witnessed any fighting or chasing that I would consider serious. So as far as mixing different apisto / dwarf species together - I know it can be done.

Good luck to you.

 

[GoDSMiLe]

Sorry, I should have been clearer. I didn't ask for pictures as any proof or anything, it just seemed like you would have a very colorful tank. I just thought I'd like to see a tank with so many different beautiful fish in it. Thank you for your help.

Mike

 

[strohl71]

GodSmile -

No apologies! I never thought you were asking for proof. I really just do not have any photos of the tank.

Good luck with your tank and let me know how it goes for you.

 

[GoDSMiLe]

Won't be able to tell you that till next fall, but I'll be sure to post pics then =D

Mike