1. Hello guest! Are you an Apistogramma enthusiast? If so we invite you to join our community and see what it has to offer. Our site is specifically designed for you and it's a great place for Apisto enthusiasts to meet online. Once you join you'll be able to post messages, upload pictures of your fish and tanks and have a great time with other Apisto enthusiasts. Sign up today!

Strange behavior macmasteri pair

Discussion in 'Husbandry / Breeding' started by danbb, Jul 20, 2014.

  1. danbb

    danbb Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2013
    Messages:
    150
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    18
    My macmasteri red mask pair has spawned with no success for 4 times until now (from what I saw). First 2 egg-laying happened inside the coconut cave, the hole has big enough for the male to enter, he drove the female outside the cave and "taking care of eggs" (after 2-3 days the eggs was gone, in that period the pair was not eating, after that everything back to normal). I changed the cave with one with entrance small enough only for the female, but ... surprise: the female spawned on the exterior of the cave, around the cave entrance. Same scenario, male chased the female away from the eggs and after 2-3 days... no eggs.
    My next move is to take out the eggs and move them alone or with mum in another tank.
    What can be the problem? Can I have 2 females or a pair with the male too thoughtful? If I have two females can them/or one of them spawn consecutively without a male around?
  2. gerald

    gerald Well-Known Member 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2006
    Messages:
    1,485
    Likes Received:
    640
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It is normal for the eggs to disappear after 2-3 days. They should have hatched (if fertile) and the mother (or maybe father)? could have moved the wrigglers somewhere else. If your "male" looks like a male, it probably is a male. With many cichlids two females will pair off and one or both will spawn if no male is available, though i have never seen Apistos do this. Young pairs sometimes have failed spawnings for a few months before they get it right.
    danbb likes this.
  3. danbb

    danbb Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2013
    Messages:
    150
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Thanks gerald. I believe they are a pair even if the relation between them is quite tense: just few times I saw them one next to each other without chases from the male. From what I have read, this can be normal to some macmasteri pairs. I will post some pictures with them.
  4. danbb

    danbb Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2013
    Messages:
    150
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Male
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Female
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Both
    [​IMG]
    I believe they are a pair, what do you think?
  5. Mike Wise

    Mike Wise Moderator Staff Member 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2004
    Messages:
    9,817
    Likes Received:
    1,331
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I tend toward your 'male' being a female. The soft dorsal and anal tips are not as pointed as on a typical male. I could be wrong, of course. It could be just a very young male. How large are the fish?
  6. danbb

    danbb Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2013
    Messages:
    150
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    18
    My "male" is 2 inches long (5 cm) and the "female" is aprox. 1,6 inches (3,8 cm).
  7. gerald

    gerald Well-Known Member 5 Year Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2006
    Messages:
    1,485
    Likes Received:
    640
    Trophy Points:
    113
    If that's a male it's an unusually colorless one. Sometimes an older dominant female in the absence of a male will get somewhat male-like coloration and behavior. There's also the faint possibility that it WAS a female and is becoming male. Dwarflover had this happen with a cacatuoides, a female who had laid eggs, raised fry, then transformed and bred as a male with another female.
    http://www.apistogramma.com/forum/threads/female-changed-sex.14548/page-2#post-76654
  8. danbb

    danbb Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2013
    Messages:
    150
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    18
    It can be a female turning into a male. I had also a female cacatuoides who laid eggs and after a time she turn into a male and bred with other female. I can't be wrong with that because she had a particular sign (a pectoral fin damaged, probably born with that problem). My "male" can be a female, like I said before, when the cave entrance was big enough to enter - the eggs was laid inside and when the cave entrance was smaller - the eggs was laid on the exterior side of the cave.
    If both are females, what is the best to do: let them like that and see what happens or try to find a male (very hard here).
  9. danbb

    danbb Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2013
    Messages:
    150
    Likes Received:
    14
    Trophy Points:
    18
    I've decided to buy a male and today I received the fish. It's a juvenile fish but quite different from the females: more color on the neck, much more pointed anal and dorsal tips.