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Pv. taeniatus Lokoundje? H. cristatus?

Discussion in 'African Cichlid Identification' started by Mike Wise, Jul 30, 2011.

  1. Mike Wise

    Mike Wise Moderator Staff Member 5 Year Member

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    Well, this is different; I need some help identifying some fish. This spring, I won a couple of pairs of what were listed as "Pv. taeniatus Lokoundje". The pair were just sexable: males <2"/5cm; females <1½"/3.5cm SL. They have grown some and one pair now has fry. Looking at the male, however, I'm wondering if the ID is correct. He doesn't show distinct ocelli along the top of the caudal. Could it be a different population or even a mix? They are domestic bred fish. I'd like some opinions.


    On another note, has anything been cleared up about the small jewel cichlids called "H. cristatus"? This is a form that I got from Larry Brown of Salt Lake City a couple of years ago. At the time, I was told that it was often labeled 'H. sp. Congo' because it was shipped from an exporter in the DRC. Now it's known to be from Nigeria. The fish seem to show the same barring and pattern of spots/halo seen on H. cristatus in Lamboj's book (p. 109-111). Just curious if it could be the true H. cristatus. If not, what should I label it?
  2. Mike Wise

    Mike Wise Moderator Staff Member 5 Year Member

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  3. tjudy

    tjudy Moderator Staff Member 5 Year Member

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    On the Pelvicachromis I am pretty confident... a mix of stuff that must include a Nigerian form. The caudal pattern shows the distinctive incomplete ocelli on the edge of the fin that are characteristic of Nigerian males.

    The Hemichromis is a tough one. Based upon the breeding color pattern your fish show, I would not say H. cristatus. The pattern for that species (from top to bottom) is red - yellow - red. Your fish look more like a gutattus color pattern. BUT... all these species are highly variable.

    H. cristatus comes from Nigeria, but have not been exported (that we know of) for a long time. Paul L. was talking about that during the ACA dinner last Saturday. Your fish is not lifilili either. I think that fish (and I had them a few years ago) is a population of cf. gutattus that happens to breed very small.
  4. aquaticclarity

    aquaticclarity Moderator Staff Member 5 Year Member

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    Male Pelvicachromis
    [​IMG]

    Female Pelvicachromis
    [​IMG]

    Hemichromis
    [​IMG]
  5. aquaticclarity

    aquaticclarity Moderator Staff Member 5 Year Member

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    I agree with Ted on the Pelvicachromis but the Hemichromis is questionable. Any chance of a better side shot of the Hemichromis while in breeding dress? The yellow that should be in the middle between the reds for cristatus looks to be wandering on the male but I think that may be the flsh/lighting/angle of the shot.
  6. viejo

    viejo Member 5 Year Member

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    The fish in the photo are offspring from the cristatus that I got from Jeff a while back. They do indeed show the bright yellow bar when given a diet with sufficient xanthophylls and are obviously the same fish pictured as cristatus in Lamboj. I am still relatively convinced that the fish shown in my avatar represents the true cristatus & that the fish in question could indeed be a dwarf form of guttatus (..And therefore most likely misidentified as true cristatus in the literature) . I have intended to get Paul's input on this subject but haven't done so thus far.
  7. Mike Wise

    Mike Wise Moderator Staff Member 5 Year Member

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    Thanks Ted and Larry for your input. Well, I guess any fry from these Pelvicachromis that survive will be lunch for Muggsy. I'm sure that these will be not only a mix of populations, but a cross between 2 species once Anton gets everything worked out. I won't be spreading these around, even if they are pretty fish. As for the Hemichromis, the parents of the pair in the photo are here:
    [​IMG]
    I tend to agree with you, Larry, they probably are a small form related to H. guttatus. The older pair are now about 3 years old and are about 3½"/8cm SL; a bit large for H. cristatus? Now I need to give them an acceptable name if I sell/trade the fry.
  8. viejo

    viejo Member 5 Year Member

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    Here is a quick 'blurry' shot of one of my breeder females which shows the yellow band to good advantage..[​IMG]
    Obviously the same fish pictured in the Lamboj book ( and still not true cristatus IMO)
  9. viejo

    viejo Member 5 Year Member

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    The fish shown in the last post is most likely a sibling of the fish in Mike's pics.
  10. Mike Wise

    Mike Wise Moderator Staff Member 5 Year Member

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    It's amazing what different foods do to the color of these fish. Mine get mostly frozen brine shrimp and other meaty foods. They never show the yellow horizontal stripe, although they do show a gold halo around the mid-lateral spot and dark vertical bars on the caudal peduncle at times. I've just started adding more vegetable flakes to their diet. I'll see what this does. Larry, what do you sell these fish as? Is there any common name?
  11. aquaticclarity

    aquaticclarity Moderator Staff Member 5 Year Member

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    Red Forest Jewei is a good common name for this fish. It's been used for the H. "cristatus" that been in the U.S. hobby easily since the late 1980's early 1990's. If you need a latin name may I suggest H. cf. cristatus or H. sp. aff. cristatus until a formal review of the genus is published?

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