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New Apistogramma described: Apistogramma aguarico sp. n.

Mike Wise

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Thanks for the 'heads up', Tom. Only did a quick scan so need to read it entirely. I wonder what the difference is between A. playayacu and A. aguarico??
 

Microman

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Ive studied many of the photos I have taken and also the live specimens that i have in my tank and I cannot see any visible differences...
The fish I have looks like the newly described A.aguarico
Thoughts Mike / Tom???
Mark...
 

Mike Wise

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Tom,
I now think the fish that Albertini imported isn't A. playayacu. I think that the species we collected at the second site - with the upper sword-like extension (Collecting site 2012-04) - is the same species as the type specimen of A. aguarico. I think the Bork fish in the description are the same species as Albertini's A. playayacu (not the type species form), but not absolutely certain. Bork's fish appear to be a bit different, possibly the same as the one we collected in Ecuador (Collecting site 2012-05). Bork's fish shows a more round caudal fin with much shorter caudal extension. For now, I'm calling the 2012-04 fish "A. cf. aguarico". I'd like to send a photo of the 2012-04 cruzi-like species to Uwe. Is that OK with you?

Dave,
Thanks, I'll email Uwe my address. Uwe's been busy. This is the second cruzi-like species that Uwe & we saw at the Field Museum. I need to go back into my notes. I don't recall right now, but other than some A. payaminonis wasn't there a cacatuoides-like species (A. sp. Rocafuerte/Shally??) among the apistos in the Ecuador collection?

Mark,
Are yours the cruzi-like form that was collected with A. payaminonis (Collecting site 2012-06) or the one imported from Albertini?
 

Tom C

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Tom, I now think the fish that Albertini imported isn't A. playayacu..........
I'd like to send a photo of the 2012-04 cruzi-like species to Uwe. Is that OK with you?
I have the same thoughts, Mike. Then the ones we got from Albertini after the trip, are A. aguarico...

resizeimage.aspx


Tom would have to confirm Mike but im almost positive my fish, I have 2 males, are from the Albertini import.
Confirmed, Mark!
 

Tom C

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Mike: Please send the actual photos to Uwe, I just told him you would do so...
 

Mike Wise

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Tom,
Yes, I think Albertini's fish are probably closer to the type specimen of A. aguarico. I can't say it is the same, however. Do Albertini's fish develop caudal extensions? I'll send Uwe a photo of the 2012-04 cruzi-like fish and see what he thinks. How many different cruzi-like forms did we find in the upper Napo, 3 - 4? A very interesting region. I'm thinking that the upper Napo of Ecuador/Peru might be the origin of all of the cruzi-subcomplex forms.
 

Tom C

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.... Do Albertini's fish develop caudal extensions? ...
How many different cruzi-like forms did we find in the upper Napo, 3 - 4? ...

No, not even the oldest, biggest males show any caudal extensions.

Yes, we found at least 3 cruzi-like forms there. (Would be interesting to spend a couple of weeks just collecting the different forms in that area more systematically..... )
 

Mike Wise

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If Albertini's fish never develop caudal extensions, my guess is that they are not the same as A. aguarico. I'll write Uwe today and see what he thinks of our "Sword-tail Cruzi". Lord, I wish we'd brought some back now. Another question. Did we give any of our Napo fish to Sergio? That's where Bork got his fish. I thought all of our extra fish went to Albertini.
 

Tom C

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Well, my males are not THAT old and big, so I cannot say they never would develop caudal extensions before next year...

I never gave any fish to Sergio... but we kept them in tanks in Francisco's place, and if he wanted to, Sergio would have easy access to those tanks... :) I don't remember if we left any spare fish there when we left...
 

Microman

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What I find interesting is how does Uwe know that A.aguarico develops filamentous caudal extensions?
Its not shown on the holotype and its certainly not shown on Borks photos.
Did you spot filamentous extensions when you visited the museum with Uwe Mike?
Now i know that Uwe does have another 4 male paratypes that might show them but
If so why didnt Uwe choose a specimen with visible caudal extensions for the holotype rather than the
specimen with a destroyed caudal/lower part missing.
Some of these fish have to grow very old to show any visible filamentous extensions in the caudal.
Mark...
 

Mike Wise

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Thanks for your information, Tom. I guess we'll just have to wait and see what develops. I'm sure we left some cruzi-like species with Francisco. I know I didn't have room for any. So maybe Sergio 'cherry-picked' what we left behind. That's fine with me. I'd rather they go to someone else than be used as fish food.:)

Mark, I really don't remember closely examining each specimen. They were, after all, mixed with other apisto species in each jar. I do remember (checked my note yesterday) that the collections included 2 distinctly different species of cruzi-like fish (now A. playayacu & A. aguarico), A. payaminonis, and a cacatuoides-like species. My guess is that Uwe chose the best overall specimen as the type specimen. I imagine that the largest male paratype had a better caudal but was less good overall. He does state that only the 2 largest (of 5 males in the collections) showed caudal extensions. It would be nice to see the caudal fin of the paratype male with caudal extension. Anyone up to go to the Field Museum in Chicago and get photos? Too far away from me.

I emailed Uwe yesterday with photos of 3 different populations that Tom, Julio & I collected in the Aguarico, Ecuador, and with payaminonis. Lord, my German is rusty! Don't know why I didn't use English; courtesy I guess. I'll be interested to read his opinion.
 

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