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Id A.uapesi form

Elendyl08

New Member
Hello,
I would like to know which brands make it possible to differentiate living specimens of A. flabellicauda from A.uaupesi. If I understood correctly, is it the vertical stripes that only appear on the back of the caudal fin?
 

Mike Wise

Moderator
Staff member
5 Year Member
You are asking a very difficult question. There is very little difference in the 2 species. Mesa & Lasso, in their description of A. flabellicauda, never compared it to A. uaupesi. They were describing fish from Venezuela & Colombia. I compared the meristic data of both species and there is almost no difference. Realize that Kullander was describing juvenile specimens of A. uaupesi which can skew the data sets.

So, are these - along with A. lineata, A. sp. D42, and A. sp. D44 - all the same species? Probably not. It might be best to look at them as being similar to A. agassizii. A. agassizii is a superspecies composed of many nearly identical but genetically separate species. The best I can say is that if they came from the Rio Ventuari or rivers entering the Orinoco just below it - and have slightly more curved rows of caudal spots and a red interior caudal wedge (like some A. uaupesi) - then it probably is A. flabellicauda. Do you know where your fish were collected?
 

Elendyl08

New Member
Thank you for taking the time to answer my question. Unfortunately I do not have a specific fishing location but there were two species in the same lot. This form of "A.uapesi" and A sp "schwanzzipfel" so they would rather come from the rio negro basin. Certain males have the yellow caudal fin: orange other rather blue and the marking is different. I attach photos of several specimens.I will try to photograph those who do not have the orange tail


A sp "schwanzzipfel"
View attachment IMG_1294.jpg
View attachment IMG_1071.jpgView attachment IMG_1070.jpg
 

Frank_H

Active Member
5 Year Member
As Mike said, you are indeed asking a very difficult question! Usually it is believed that the caudal pattern is a reliable feature to distinguish A. uaupesi, flabellicauda, lineata etc.. But as you can see from your own photos 1071 and 1070, this isn't the case: The specimen in photo 1071 shows a fan-like caudal pattern in the middle part of the fin, as supposed to be the case in A. flabellicauda and the one in 1070 has a completely patterned caudal like in A. lineata. And in fact, as has been shown in at least two cases, the offspring of wild "uaupesi-like" species/forms from the same catch location can show all kinds of caudal pattern! From completely patterned to (almost) unpatterned! And as if this was not enough, in at least some of these species/forms the caudal pattern can diminsh or even vanish completely when aging! However, your A. sp. Schwanzzipfel is very nice :)
 

Drayden Farci

Active Member
These look similar to mine from the Rio Jufari, which folks on the Apistogramma World group on Facebook believe to be A. cf. flabellicauda. In mine, the intensity of red in the caudal seems to come and go depending on mood. In my wild male, it's a subtle orange if anything. In some fry, it is bright red.
 
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