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Breeding Mikrogephagus ramirezii

Boupette

Member
5 Year Member
Hello there!

The smallest fry I never had in my tanks apart Bettas! There mouth is too small for microworms or BB brines shrimps. I bought some Infusyl but there's so many negatives about it that I'm scared to use it. You, the breeders of this specie what do you suggest me please?

 

dw1305

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Hi all,
I'd definitely use the infusoria, and I'd also squeeze out a filter sponge for them, as this is a very good source of rotifers. The very small, nematode "Banana Worm" <http://www.worm-cultures.com/bananaworminformation.htm> are good, and very prolific. They are less than 1/2 as big as Microworms.

Personally for all small and difficult fry I like the "Java Moss" method <http://www.apistogramma.com/forum/index.php?threads/german-ram-wigglers.11256/#post-60914>, and I'm also using a lot of dead leaves now as well.

cheers Darrel
 

wethumbs

Active Member
5 Year Member
It all depends on your goal. If you just want enough for BAP points at your local club, then the sponge filter or Java moss techniques would do just fine. Most hobbyists would be happy to get 10 to 50% from each batch of ram.

Since I have an upward of 3000 ram fry in my fishroom at any given time with multiple breeding pairs of various types of ram, the only sure way is to culture protists in the range of 100 micron to 350 micron size to ensure amber supply of fry food. This will guarantee to make the most out of each batch of ram (>90% survival rate).
 

Boupette

Member
5 Year Member
If you just want enough for BAP points at your local club, then the sponge filter or Java moss techniques would do just fine...
No it is not my goal even if I'm a member of my local club here. I do it cos I love to do reproduction. I have differents species most south american dwarfs and I sell most of my fishes in several lfs and members of Quebec's aquarists forums. But I don't have the place to do it as much as you.

I did squeeze the sponge-filter for the first days and now they are eating microworms and few of them bbs. The father is still with them for the 4rth day of free swimming. He seems to be a good father but since I read that most of them are eating them, I don't know if I should keep him with them. What do you think, should I remove the father?
 

dw1305

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Hi all,
I did squeeze the sponge-filter for the first days and now they are eating microworms and few of them bbs.
Well done, that is the really difficult bit with Ram fry, should be OK from now on.
He seems to be a good father but since I read that most of them are eating them, I don't know if I should keep him with them. What do you think, should I remove the father?
Keep an eye on him, but keep him in.

cheers Darrel
 

Boupette

Member
5 Year Member
12 days of free swimming now 3 days without father who jumped out the tank! He was showing signs of white spots, and now I see the same on few of the fry. What should I do? Is 86-87°F is too hot for them?

 

Mike Wise

Moderator
Staff member
5 Year Member
I'd slowly raise the temperature as you suggested and make small water changes. I don't like to use chemical cures on such small fish.
 

Boupette

Member
5 Year Member
No, I don't too and for Ick I always use salt and raise the temp at 86-87. I will only raise the temp this time. I hope it'll be ok. I never had fry with Ick.
 

Boupette

Member
5 Year Member
Here they are after 14 days of freeswimming. I find them quite big, in fact they grow faster than most Apistogramma I raised and I've read that the Rams grow very slowly ... I cannot believe it!!! :D

I give them 3-4 meals of Artemia everyday + ¼ water change every other day. It won't take long before I'll need to use another tank. Temp is now at 86°C (30°C), they'er doing ok.

This video is not very clear but what I wanted to do was some close-up, I'm not 100% successful but it's better than nothing. They are about + / - 1cm.

 

wethumbs

Active Member
5 Year Member
Rams actually grow very fast. Mine are over 1" (typically 3cm) by 3 months of age. Aside from a few Apistos like cacatuoides and agassizii that will grow faster than rams, most Apistos are painfully slow growers.
 

wethumbs

Active Member
5 Year Member
I feed them Repashy gel food so they actually feed all day long in addition to two feedings of newly hatched artemia everyday. They also get 80% daily water change as well.

I am assuming the 'white spots' on the fry are protozoa instead of fungus attack. In that case, I have used copper sulfate treatment on fry before with limited losses (like less than 5%). Just make sure to increase aeration as the treatment will deplete dissolved oxygen level. Also turning off the light or shorten the duration will help. If the spots are caused by fungus attack, then I have used PimaFix with very good result on D. maculatus fry. Obviously, with any medication, frequent water changes is highly recommended and repeat dosing maybe necessary.

Here are a few pictures of the critical stage of fry development. The pictures are low-res on purpose to keep people from 'stealing' them.

1st day freeswimmer (the scale on the background is 100micron per major increment)


2nd day freeswimmer


3rd day freeswimmer
 

wethumbs

Active Member
5 Year Member
I glanced through the website you provided. It definitely got some mis-information. It showed a picture of a developing embryo as 4 to 5 days old, which is incorrect as they hatched in approx. 40hrs. The one-month old fry picture that looked deformed is more like 1 day old freeswimmer.

BTW, here is one of my EBR females with two weeks old fry.
 

Boupette

Member
5 Year Member
I don't think it is fungus but Ick (whitespots disease). Increasing the temp around 30°C for 14 days will be ok.

I never heard yet about Repashy gel food. I made a research and I found it at Ted's. Thanks a lot!
 

wethumbs

Active Member
5 Year Member
I get my Repashy from Ted, just picked up another 64oz pack at the ACA convention in July.
 

dw1305

Well-Known Member
5 Year Member
Hi all,
I think you are in a situation where you can only resort to medication. I'm not sure what you can get in Canada, but I've used ESHA EXIT successfully. It is malachite green based (Acridine, Malachite Green, Meth. Violet &
Meth. Blue) which isn't ideal, but it worked for me without any deaths.

cheers Darrel
 

Boupette

Member
5 Year Member
Hello there! A little update about my rams. Only 2½ months , they do not yet have all their colors that are already they spawn!! Wonderfull experiences through it all...
Thanks to you guys, cause I didn't know how to nourrish them in the first days I wouldn't have been very far without the trick of squeezing out the filter sponge. Next time will be Repashy gel food.
Very rewarding experience!

 
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