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A. panduro heavy breathing + wound.

Discussion in 'Dwarf Cichlid Health' started by MaestroCygni, Apr 2, 2018.

  1. MaestroCygni

    MaestroCygni New Member

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    Hi all! My Apistogramma panduro male seems to be breathing heavily and has some sort of wound.

    This is the wound, under the mouth, close to the gills. The other side is perfectly fine.
    It looks like several bubbles, and for a second I thought a snail might have laid eggs, but that doesn't really make sense.
    IMG_20180402_193047.png

    Here is a video of the heavy breathing. Sorry for the mess, but since it's not a display tank, I wanted as much microfauna as possible in case they bred.



    Water parameters:
    Temp. 24ÂșC
    pH: 6,0
    Kh: 3
    Gh: 4
    NO2: O
    NO3: 5

    Does anybody know what this could be? I'm thinking parasites, but all other fish seem perfectly fine. He's eating well though.
  2. gerald

    gerald Well-Known Member 5 Year Member

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    I'd guess Mycobacterium, which often causes open sores on the head, body, or base of fins. https://dianawalstad.com has a good article on Myco, with photos of an angelfish with similar sores around the mouth. In my experience it's one of the commonest killers of Apistos that have been well-kept and survived to old age, though it can certainly attack young fish too. If it's progressing slowly, Myco-infected fish can sometimes still breed and yield healthy offspring before if eventually kills them. (Remove eggs or fry ASAP of course). Or, it could be some other infection - there are many causes of sores and heavy breathing.
  3. MaestroCygni

    MaestroCygni New Member

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    So, in case it is Myco, what should I do? Take the female out? Is it infectious? Should I desinfect everything that is used in that tank? Is it a danger to all other tanks?
    Sorry for the questions, but I'm reading very varied things on the internet.
  4. gerald

    gerald Well-Known Member 5 Year Member

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    I've gradually come to the realization that Mycobacterium is probably present in nearly every aquarium, breeding facility, natural water body, and in many frozen foods and maybe even dry foods that are not cooked at high temperature. Myco are present in wet soil and many public water supply systems too. You can try disinfecting everything if you want to, but as soon as you add any water, fish, plant, food, etc you might get it again. It is definitely infectious, but usually slow-growing and not disease-causing in otherwise healthy fish. When fish are stressed, sick, or old it starts growing and eventually kills them, but it can take years. Which also means that quarantine is of limited use against Myco; long-term carriers often show no symptoms. Myco seems to have gotten more common in the aquarium trade over the past few decades with the increase in global tropical fish farming and trade. Most of us just learn to live with it, and remove Myco-infected fish when they start getting weak. Don't let them die in the tank with other fish. Occasionally fish with minor sores do heal up and the Myco seems to go dormant again, for months or years. Diana had some success using a UV sterilizer, which presumably lowered the ambient levels of Myco in the water. Some of her rainbowfish that had Myco-like sores lived for many years after the UV treatment. Heat and good diet may also help. Some antibiotics occasionally help slow it down, if it hasn't already damaged vital organs (heart, kidney, liver, spleen). But there's no really reliable treatment in fish. There are many opinions about fish-Myco and how to deal with it; mine is just one perspective.
    ButtNekkid and MaestroCygni like this.
  5. MaestroCygni

    MaestroCygni New Member

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    Thank you! This was very helpful!
  6. MaestroCygni

    MaestroCygni New Member

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    Update. This is looking like myco, sadly.
    It is not getting new wounds though, and the breathing seems a bit better, so it might be a normal wound. He's still eating fine.
    IMG_20180406_230655.jpg IMG_20180406_230457.jpg

    The container was only for the pictures, by the way.

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